Rangers Banter Archive June 12 2012

12 Jun 2012 22:18:31
Will the history of the club die with it?

No the history will remain with the Rangers PLC into the new company and the titles and all of the 140 years of history will remain with the new club! go to bbc and listen rather than just guessing!

ONLY if u pay all debts also. Keep the history keep the debt

U can't have the titles debt free

That woud just be silly right?

That would be the same BBC that said in 1987 that there was 'no hurricane on the way' I assume.
Club dies...history dies...simples.

King billy kept his titles and he is dead ranger,s can keep their,s but they are dead.dead is dead,only remembered in history books,newco have to write their history yet,garlar07

These bears just dont get it, i thought they were brighter than that

Here is another quote from the BBC,this might make it clear to the OP

What happens to the club's history?
The Rangers Football Club PLC is a public limited company registered in Scotland (company number: SC004276) and was incorporated on 27 May, 1899. When the current company is officially liquidated, all of its corporate business history will come to an end.
When this happened to Airdrieonians in 2002, all of the trophies, titles and records associated with the club were discontinued and a new club, Airdrie United FC, took over. Airdrieonians' official history ended in 2002, then Airdrie United's took over.

12 Jun 2012 22:03:32
this is to my uncle davey the man who used to bring me to see the celtic as a kid im from england and have allways supported and went to the games starting from the young age of 10 im now 40 ,it gives me no pleasure to see a true fan of rangers and some one i love to be hurting so to all those true blues good luck and we will see yous soon english tim

12 Jun 2012 22:15:06
What happens to the club's history?
The Rangers Football Club PLC is a public limited company registered in Scotland (company number: SC004276) and was incorporated on 27 May 1899. When the current company is officially liquidated, all of its corporate business history will come to an end.
When this happened to Airdrieonians in 2002, all of the trophies, titles and records associated with the club discontinued - a new club, Airdrie United FC took over. Airdieonians' official history ended in 2002, then Airdrie United's took over.
The answer lies principally in the eye of the beholder - some supporters will view the new Rangers as the same Rangers, while others will feel the old Rangers no longer exist. So basically your next spl title will be your first

Briggs

That was suppose to be ACF Fiorentine not AFC Fiorentina.

Theres a slight difference with the airdrie case tho coz they actually took over clydebank who were going out the game also they took over there membership of the league thus loosing there old history and not being able to use the airdrieonians name. the rangers football club plc is only the name of the company that owned rangers the club there not actually the club, its like buying a second car if i end up skint and the garage take my car back and sell it to u the car is still the same make and model still drives the same and has the same mileage on the clock same physical thing just diff owner

Im sure Rangers will be allowed to keep their history. Fiorentina had to start again a few years ago, and they kept their previous history but just changed their name to AFC Fiorentina instead.

Eye of the beholder,yes.People will see ,feel,think what they want to,what suits them.However the history stops today as has been said so often.A new history starts with the new club.

Airdrie had no assets. Following bankruptcy the reformed club were denied entry to the SFL - Gretna got the place instead. So someone bought Clydebank, renamed and renamed them Airdrie. Hardly the same.

Think our situation will be similar to Fiorentinas...although we probably should start in Div3 like they did. SG

12 Jun 2012 21:32:01
Rangers will not lose their history. It just stops here (- any stripped) the history books will always have rangers honours listed just like third lanark etc. The new club is an opportunity to build something modern and with such a huge fan base it could truly lead the way. So much of football has lost its way.

No matter what your history is finished with the club and the so called history that you will remember will always be TAINTED and your club will forever be remembered as a corrupt and cheating club. so spin it any way you want,just like this whole saga, but the fact is your club cheated for many years and that is what your history is no matter if you get stripped of titles. this is the BIGGEST scam in history of football and that is what the record books will show. lose the watap thinking and face facts in what your club did and acted.

12 Jun 2012 21:23:00
so glad i bought the domain name,glasggow rangers ltd for £26. ill make a fortune ? craig whyte {Ed039's Note - Well done Mr Whyte, you spelt Glasgow with 2 g's in the middle so I dont think you will make any money ;-)

On a celtic site it seems that a huge percentage of Rangers domains have been bought up by tims

Nice one ED

Thats how i got it so cheap ed,we all make mistakes !!

Come on ed, guys got a stutter. (bet you love wee funny asides (attempted ?) when the switchboards on fire.

12 Jun 2012 21:21:15
Lets be honest Rangers will never recover from this. Our name will be gone, we will no longer be known as "The Rangers" what self respecting company will want to get involved in sponsoring us, the team formerly known as "The Rangers" no one will touch us with a barge pole. If we do end up playing in whatever league next season, i predict it will only be a matter of time before we end up in administration again.

12 Jun 2012 21:16:43
It is rather ironic that we are accused of burying our head in the sand re our problems.I posted earlier about the potential of our demise from the spl, below is from the CQN website,be afraid bhoys of what you reap.

HMRC reject CVA as Rangers head for liquidation
Posted on 12 June, 2012 by Paul67
230
BBC today confirmed what we have been telling you would happen for months, HMRC have rejected the proposed Rangers CVA.  One of the world’s oldest and most successful football clubs will now be liquidated.

Despite what should have been well-informed opinion from the Scottish accountancy profession, the proposal from Charles Green was always – always – destined to fail.  His proposal to investors offered to treat football creditors different from other creditors in the same class, including HMRC, which contravenes the terms within which HMRC are able to agree to a CVA.

The line “All creditors to be wiped clear on consideration of £8.5m save for £3m being owed to other football clubs” ensured HMRC had no choice.

Prepare for the most intense two weeks of lobbying in Scottish history.  Once the SPL received notification from Duff and Phelps of their intention to liquidate they will simultaneously receive an application from Sevco 588 to join the league.

My sources, which confirmed all along that the Sevco CVA proposal would contain a deal-breaker for HMRC, now tell me that Sevco will offer to back plans on the SPL voting structure, allowing home gate money to be shared at a vote in the near future as a price of getting entry to the league.

Sevco will gain out of this, as they will be able to sell more tickets to the SPL than the third division, the Gang of 10 will also gain, it is only Celtic who will lose financially as your season ticket money is offered BY SEVCO as an incentive to get them into the league.

Without Sevco in the league the Gang of 10 would be able to change the voting rights anyway but if Sevco acquiesce on sharing gate money, the Gang get to keep sponsors, TV money and earn a whole new slice of income every time they visit Celtic Park.

Enjoy your ice cream and jelly.  There will be more soon on the consequences of liquidation of Rangers and what would be left in the event of a phoenix, but prepare for the bedlam that lies ahead.

Prepare for bedlam that lies ahead ........

Bedlam your Club owners created simple as

Bigbr

With or without Serveco the 10 can now put through what ever they like

Stop thinking about Celtic and how ooohh our club is gone so Celtic is going to be hurting. Celtic are a proper run club and even if the gang of 10 change things we will make even more money outside of the league and with our players that we can sell 5 of them for 10mill each we are ok. STOP CLICHING THE STRAWS and yes your head is still in the sand, we are playing top europe clubs in preseason which we can make alot on which is just one way to make money and ooooya CL, but you can just watch us and other clubs prosper.
havent yous been proven wrong with your watap thinking and the whole Celtic paranoia thing because thats what it looks like so since you were all wrong about that dont you think you could be wrong in thinking everyone is going to fold with out yous? change your mind with your new club will help yous out.

UEFA would not allow this. It's nonsense.
No clubs all over the world share home gate receipts and SPL chairmen are not looking for it.

12 Jun 2012 20:59:01
Does brian kennedy own weatherseal the new spl sponsors???

Inverbear

12 Jun 2012 20:55:07
Brace yourselves, there are still outstanding issues to be decided EBT's, the alternative punishment to the player embargo, for example, to name but two!

12 Jun 2012 20:41:44
Why are all the EBT loans not being called in ? FFS! {Ed039's Note - Because they were never intented to be repaid, thats the deal, thats why HMRC are trying to prove they were illegally used in avoiding tax payments)

12 Jun 2012 20:28:50
NOTHING will change. Rangers will be called Rangers. Rangers will play at Ibrox. If SPL clubs want to cut their nose off to spite their face... It's 3rd division and the long road to recovery. Rangers are and always will be Rangers, proud world record holders of domestic titles won and established in 1872. It's one company transfering to another... It won't affect any one of us in the stands. Fact.

Blue {Ed039's Note - Hopefully one thing will change, hopefully we will pay our bills in an honest and professional manner. I genuinely am gutted for the small creditors who are desperate for the money. Guys like the taxi drivers etc who might not have been paid etc)

Ed your spot on the creditors have paid a heavy price for the mess our club is in and i for one is truely sorry for this i just wish a few more rangers fans could show some regret i would go to the third div and try to come back then we ccan say we did our time sad day for rangers but also for all those who have lost mone again sorry to you all. Cooperboy

12 Jun 2012 20:12:52
Celtic fan here and not on to gloat. The 140 year history good and bad can never be taken away it will only stop. I would imagine the old rangers could still be saved but the only people who could do it are the fans, they are the only ones who care enough about the club and it's history, all the business men and money men are only in it for the fast buck. I said the other night that every season ticket holder could agree to pay an extra £150/ £200 per season and enter a payment plan with hmrc....hmrc getting £10m from a liquidation sale or £7/£8m a season for the next 6/7 years is a no brainer. Regain your dignity and save your history, rangers sadly are crying out for a Brian Dempsey or a fergus McCann to lead the supporters in the right direction.

Jd

You have to remember mccann could offer something you didn't Have b4, shares.rangers are not in that position, so effectively your point is the fans should pay for the directors sins, come on Get real.

The fans lapped up the fruits of the directors' sins for years - so why not?

Yes McCann offered something different, rangers are looking for a saviour....which I recon Is slightly more important than shares. If someone gave me the chance to save my club for £200 for the next 5 years I would bite the hand of it.

Jd

Mccann saw a good profit via the share issue, he certainly didn't do it as a fan. He was and is a very astute business man, 9m in 40m out, stated how long he would stay then leave,so at least learn the history of your club.

You have been paying for years for your,e
directors sins. yes fergus gave us something to go on from. you were spending money for years you didn,t have

4' If he was not a fan he would not have staked his stash,fergus himself has said this. mug

And your point is? McCann came with a plan to make money, was honest from day one and left at the end with a healthy profit. Rangers haven't had an honest man at the helm for years, the way forward for rangers is for fans to take control of their club and retain its history- without history you are just another ordinary club. As said previously £200 per season ticket holder for 6/7 years would clear all debt, regain the clubs dignity and most of all retain it's proud history. Yes that's not happened at other clubs in administration but no other club with the history of rangers has gone into admin before. A huge price to pay to save your club??

Jd

12 Jun 2012 20:08:44
So that it is it we are now a Newco,The time has come to start a Fresh as has been indicated by HMRC.
We need to look no further than the Highlands to see that even small teams can advance so if we really have a massive support and we are true fans we will generate the income to drive Rangers back to where we belong or are we just the Murray Glory hunters the rest of Scottish football are trying to tag us with.

12 Jun 2012 19:59:24
So reading into this HMRC statement, if we start a new co does that mean the result of the BIG tax case will have no effect on the new co and any money owed from this will essentially go into the creditors pot for the old company? If so i think we've not come out of this too badly! Especially if we get back into the SPL but lets be honest if we don't have european football for 3 years we may as well suck it up and go into 3rd division to teach everyone else a lesson for kicking us when we were down!

Yea,the lesson will be dont cheat and pay your taxes or you end up liquidated and in the third div!

Ok fellow bears. the ?ankers who we worshiped ie. SDM and to a lesser degree that crook WHYTE ran our great and proud club into the gutter. They done the crime so we pay the fine and do the time. They can take away as many titles as they want SFA, SPL or Scottis league it doesnt matter you can't erase history or most monarchs and prime ministers of Britain would have tried it years ago. Lets go down to the third division and start again. Then we can watch the Thompsons Yorksons etc join us . We will be there in a 100 years time as Rangers 2012 or whatever we want to call the newco but will the rest of Scottish football apart from maybe Sceptic and possibly Ross County. SAUSAGE BEAR

It all started off so well and then you had to drag up the old "teach everyone else a lesson" rubbish. No one is to blame except Rangers.
Al

Hi ed can you advise on this, rangers were
given a one year ban from europe for going into admin and a three year ban for
liquidation will it be three or four {Ed001's Note - should be 3, as that supercedes the original penalty.}

12 Jun 2012 19:52:04
Green looking phased and unsettled on TV, talking about wasting his time, fans time, jittery voice. I think this guy is walking away. He didn't plan on div3 and no Europe for min 3 years.
That wasn't his business plan or economics.

Lord Carloway will rule on the punishment (crime confirmed) in a week for the SFA on the bringing the game into disrepute.
Only suspension from Scottish football for a year is really available.
The SFA and SPL can decide if any newco should continue to burden the penalties of an oldco. Might not seem fair but they can do what they like. {Ed039's Note - They usually do what they like anyway, any punishments attached the the share of the oldco will transfer to the newco)

No Europe for 3 years means employee downsizing by at least 50% at new company. Straightforward break even economics.

Reply to eds comment 1 if the punishment is attached to the old Co share and Rangers set up the Newco and go to 3rd Div where does the share and therefore the punishment end up logic would suggest whichever team takes over rangers share in the SPL but fairness would suggest not. what a fabulous array of conundrums Scottish football create.

12 Jun 2012 19:43:09
I hope that when the liquidators come in that they look at everyone involved in 'tax avoidance' within Ibrox past and present. All the 'so called' loans tax free whilst everyone else has to pay their taxes promptly and in full. It has been the tax issues that have been our downfall and I pray that HMRC get any payments due from greedy owners, directors, Managers and players. FFS they were earning a fortune! Why was that not enough? Why, tell me WHY?

12 Jun 2012 19:39:54
I'm not clutching at straws, but does the 28 day cooling off period still stand ? as this could be our last chance, whether the fans, wealthy Rangers fans, or both can come up with serious money. The fans groups have to get together with the blue knights to see if this is possible. What do you guy's think ?. sadcat.

Did HMRC not say that if the CVA collapsed then D&P would have two weeks to find an alternative bider. Not sure that applies when the CVA is not put in place

Cooling off period was for the CVA, was it not? {Ed039's Note - The cooling off period does not apply when the old company is formally liquidated, what would be cooling off be for?)

Thats why your in this mess.You are the most uninformed bunch ever.You have sleepwalked into this.Timmy rubbish eh?

Short answer is no. If you sign up to an insurance policy you get a cooling off period to allow you to reconsider. You don't need a cooling off period for not signing up to one. It's there to protect people from pressure selling.
Al

The 28 days 'cooling off' period is only if a CVA is passed, to cool off lol.
The Thursday meeting will not take place, no reason. {Ed039's Note -The creditors meeting will take place on Thursday but it is just a formality)

If that is the case then I expext us to get notice of our 3 year european ban the morra. If not then I might have a case..sadcat.

12 Jun 2012 19:27:45
right lets clear something up, the corporate side of rangers are liquidated but the football side lives on, meaning history of titles etc lives on.

Does the selling side of say Woollies live on. Or Borders. Or Enron

Go on surprise me by make a more sane attempt to reconcile Rangers liquidated with Servico 2012 taking their history

Better still. Prove u love your wife!

Mojo

Totally wrong!!!
Rangers FC Plc incorporated 1899 are finished a brand new company and club need to restart. It's an incorporated club and an newly incorporated club needs to start afresh.
All current employees are made redundant and a new company/ club registered at companies house has to offer new jobs on the new headed corporate paper.

@2 well your very wrong , employees (footballers & and the ordinary working employess for the want of a better title) contracts are tupe'd over to the new company.

12 Jun 2012 19:16:17
Team Duffer on the news tonight saying all players contracts will transfer to newco on TUPE terms.
Conveniently forgetting that the other part of TUPE, allows affected employees to 'walk away', if they do not wish to be part of the new company.

I'm going to lie in a dark room for a week!!

bil72

On liquidation ALL contracts are null and void. Players need their new sign on fees to make up for 6 months of 25% salaries.
The players union directors say they walk for free on liquidation or newco.

This is a grey area and is likely to involve several court cases. Further delays and expenses, just what you need

Players agents, backed by Lawyers, say they walk for free.

Green statement tonight saying if the players don't transfer over to Sevco FC they will be in breach of contract. This could get messy.
Al

Green is talking out of his arse. We did away with indentured labour centuries ago.

12 Jun 2012 19:03:36
Green on telly questioning HMRC decision
Is it a new policy? he asks. He is a chancer
I and probably plenty others read their policy about CVAs on their site months ago They do deal in CVA s but only if previous tax record is ok

It doesnt matter anymore he sorts out the new club and they chase the old owners 4 the tax money same name same history different corporate shell, a think thats how they put it lol

The policy was mentioned here daily for
Months but dismissed as Timmy trouble.

12 Jun 2012 18:47:21
Hmrc are a joke as they said they dont do cva,s but correct me but did they not give portsmouth nd Leeds a yes on a cva is so they should tell them they shouldn't have got 1. A message to the other fans we wont walk away from OUR club

But you want to walk away from your debt? {Ed039's Note - Have you not been reading most posts, most fans including myself are disgusted and/or embarassed about the whole situation about creditors wronged)

What I don't understand is why didn't hmrc inform rangers or duff and Phelps about this so called "policy decision"months ago and stop.wasting everyones time.

The difference with leeds and portmouth is that HMRC was not the major creditor and was not in a position to block the CVA and in both cases the company did not have a 10 year history of tax evasion

OP: did those clubs owe as much as Rangers to HMRC and had they been avoiding PAYE and NI payments?

@2: everyone knew about HMRC policy months ago - it's on their website and loads of people on here have stated it.

3)
& neither has RFC - we went into admin. For last years missing tax etc.
Anything else still not proven

bil72

Bil72, D&P seem to disagree with your view staing that "the historical non-compliance with tax liabilities by the former owners and directors of the club" was the fundamental reason why HMRC rejected the proposal. Note the use of former owners, CW was only one owner.
Al

12 Jun 2012 18:46:02
lets go to division 3 let the rest rot

Nice attitude.No wonder people don't like us.

Why do you want the rest to rot, they didn't make this happen to us.

With an attitude like that they will not let us into Div 3.

12 Jun 2012 18:35:41
This site shouldn't really be called rangers rumours anymore. . . Don't exist

12 Jun 2012 18:24:57
Celtic fan here.iam shocked and disgusted how 2 greedy people can ruin our game.all the fans now suffering.the way a loyal and faithfull fan be treated for their cash tp be ripped off.
I think rangers fans should buy club mk dons style.
I realy am sorry for yous.
I dont know where it leaves scottish football.jail should follow follow.
Best of luck rangers.

Cheers m8 good post.

Why don't the fans buy the club?You couldn't do any worse!

2)
Might just be possible, but how then do we keep it going?
It costs upwards of 20mil p year just to keep it ticking over

bil72

12 Jun 2012 18:17:14
i have just repurchased my season tickets for self and my 14 yo boy. i dont get the newco argument fears.
i never supported a limited company... i supported a club.... handed to me by my father.... to pass onto my son.
He told me when celtic were winning 9 in a row thats this is the time they need your support and i supported them home and away then.
Now ive said the same to my 14 yo now and he "gets it' and hes had none of the glory years with gazza and laudrup. .
to stop supporting them now is shameful. we stick together. we did no wrong but we apologise on behalf of murray and white because were better than them.
and we rise leaner and better in every way.
we intoroduce cheap tickets in sfl if req for children.
we leave any sectarian nonsense behind.
but we support the club..... that nebulous thing we hold in our hearts.
My wee boy gets it guys.... so for those of us who dined out in the fine years, now we take our medicine and ensure we hand to our children something that can give them the joy we have had. and we teach them to pay taxes and not sing sectarian songs... but we teach them about loyalty and support for their friends, their family... and their club!

A speech worthy of Churchill. Hope you get your wish.

Will you get your money back,hope you do mate,garlar07

Exactly.If we got relegated 3 seasons in a row I would hope that the majority would stick with us. This is no different and Rangers F.C need us . If you cant take the bad times dont milk the good times. Rangers are not my life ,they are part of my life, I will not turn away my family or friends and I will not walk away from Rangers. There will always be a Rangers, ALWAYS.....AYE READY

12 Jun 2012 17:53:14
please post this Ed

Well guys im doing the Walking Away i said all along i will not be supporting a Newco IM RANGERS TILL I DIE not some cheap imitation good luck to the guys who can support a newco but i hope there arnt to many of you for months i have watched rangers being slowly killed off read the gloating remarks of the other spl fans but mostly the nice but dhims. read the comments of other chairman, well you think you dont need us well we will have to wait and see. personaly i think the last few agonising months that Rangers went through will seem like a mercy killing compared to the slow painfull death of Scottish Football R.I.P Rangers ROT IN HELL SCOTTISH FOOTBALL.

a very bitter and angry Lochaber Bear signing off for good {Ed039's Note - Goodbye LB, your entitled to your opinion, but I for one when things are sorted will be contacting Colin on the Fort William Loyal to see if a bus is still running and will always support Rangers one way or another, at least there will still be one Lochaber Bear making the journey down the A82 and not walking away. I hope you change your mind when the anger subsides, take care)

Hey Ed colin very seldom uses the bus now i will miss our stops at Dempsey tho i may support a newco if we start in the third division but i will not go anywhere near one that buckles to the SPL and their long lists of sanctions they can take what they want from us but never our pride

Lochaber bear

ps how do you know mr C P

I understand your grief and want to say shame on you.
well support you evermore we said.
well support you from the pavements we said.
Struth talked of the hard times...this is them.
I know your hurting and i understand your thoughts.
we are not a limited company. companies die and change and get taken over. we werent even a company for 20 years or so.
think again my riend. reflect and stick together. these are the hard times and these will define us

LB
I know you are hurting - I understand - but have another think about it over the next few days and over the weekend. Your team needs you and fellow Good Bears now more than ever. (and I would miss your posts).

Good LUCK, Good Bears.

Gerry {Ed039's Note - Agreed Gerry)

Bye bye bitter bear even bowing out you still show no class,this is no ones fault but Rangers

You sound the type who would be first in the lifeboat to hell with the women and children. Sevco Rangers will be better without you.

Glory hunter.he has been saying for months rangers would never be liquidated,now he's off!

@OP: why are you hoping Scottish football will rot in hell? Surely you should take your anger out on those who have ruined your club?

Sorry to hear your hurting but remember the fans and the team are the club, without either there is no club. Lets start again and mould it the way we would like to see it in the future. If it means more money from me then so be it and if the fans fought to buy it then i would be part of it. Just don't know how.

12 Jun 2012 17:32:07
why do so many rangers fans feel that the newco preserves their history.it does not.rangers will be a new company and start from scratch.its pretty basic stuff.

on the bright side getting the chance to witness rangers first trophy in division 3 will be a historic day to say the least

I think most people r missing the point 1 all players r free 2 move on now point 2 this rubbish about rangers assets only being worth 5.5mill will not work taxman has said assets at rangers r about 50mill point3 u will be lucky 2 even get into 3rd because not enough time to get that sorted rangers cant apply 2 do anything untill liqud is finished

Your so wrapped up in our 54 titles and our bulletin boards you cant even enjoy your league win.
rangers in my soul young man... its not the limited company or even the stadium or anything.... its more than that... much more... if you need it explained you dont get what being a supporter is...
and before you say we cant take it or show remorese... yes i am remorseful and regretful and pay my taxes.. and the people in charge shud have done so.... the did wrong... as some at celtic too have done wrong over the years... we dont support these individuals... we dont supprt the plc or ltd... we support the club.... see you in 3-4 years if thats what it takes... but ill be there... with my head held high... i pay my taxes...

Suggest you brush up on company law , all trophies, records etc transfer over to the newco.

3# i suggest you wake up and smell the coffee. You will be a NEW COMPANY,you really think you leave debt but take honours?

No 3 Correct company ownership changes
not the football club,like buying a second hand car,new owner same vehicle and history.

Yes but your NOT buying a second hand car. Youre buying a NEW CAR

New car new history geddit

Mo

The history does not transfer. For example MG-Rover went bust and SAIC bought the liquidated company including the MG trade mark. They did not inherit the Race wins of MG and land speed records. The history books award them to MG now defunct.

Company's Act 2006 @6 it's law do you geddit ?

@2: why do you assume the OP is a Celtic fan? Isn't it slightly ironic that you accuse them of being obsessed with Rangers when you automatically assume they're a Celtic fan?

Naw it's like buying a second hand car then winding the mile clock back n selling it as a new one {Ed039's Note - This has got to be the most bizarre comparison I have seen yet)

12 Jun 2012 17:04:21
There are no winners here if Rangers go to the third division but I would rather as a season ticket holder and a life long fan go to the 3rd division and start again its the only fair a true punishment for the financial mismanagement over the last fews years - We the fans will be the only ones who suffer whilst Murray and Whyte walk away unaffected - totally disgusted but will still support my club whatever happens.

Gers1986

Only problem is it is not your team.Your team are liquidated.

How can a brand new company go straight into the SPL? It's just not on.
That would be insulting to all SPL teams and all good honest teams in sfl1, sfl2 and sfl3 who work hard day in day out to try and get into the SPL.

12 Jun 2012 17:01:15
Does this  ow mean All players and staff contracts are now void? If so how does the newco propose to fund the new contracts?? Worrying times indeed.

Officially everyone will be made redundant from the old company. Once the brand new company is up and running, and there is a board of directors, and they have assets and know what market (SPL or SFL). They will trade in, they can start offering jobs.

12 Jun 2012 16:43:38
Newco is not the end of the club. The club and all it's assets we're owned by the company this includes the name rangers football club, ibrox, the club badge, Murray park etc. Celtic and Leeds are newco's but the clubs survive. Probably completely wrong but that's the way I see it. gazza72 {Ed039's Note - Celtic are not a newco)

Ed 39 can you explain how atlantic shelf 595 ltd took over celtic

JG {Ed039's Note - Explanation from Ed007 -

The Celtic Football and Athletic Company LtdI think when you have been asked the same question about six times in a few days it?s worthexplaining the issue here. If a football club is liquidated it?s finished. Continuity with its history and records ends. This is not the same as a football company changing its name.Celtic was established as a sporting club at a meeting in a church hall in November 1887, in many ways, no different than a million other football, karate and badminton clubs. It subsequently registered with the SFA in 1888. In April 1897 it incorporated as a private limited company, registering as The Celtic Football and Athletic Company Ltd at Companies House. It was the 3487 th company to register in Scotland and was given the incorporation number SC003487.In 1994 the company became a public limited company and changed its name to Celtic PLC but,of course, remained the same company, with the same incorporation number and retained the same registration with the SFA. You can check our corporate history, from incorporation in 1879, to name change in 1994 to our most recent annual return, dated 31 December 2011 (or relevant year), at Companies House.On the same day Celtic changed its name to Celtic PLC, Fergus McCann changed the name of an off the shelf company, securing the old trading name ?The Celtic Football and Athletic Company Ltd?, which is fully owned by Celtic PLC, but is not registered as a football club)

Are Leeds a newco? Didn't all their players get sold/released to prevent liquidation? Or am I wrong?

TTG {Ed039's Note - I asked Ed011 but he is not exactly sure)

Celtic were never in admin let alone liquidated

Celtic are not a newco. They changed from being a límited company to a plc as you must when going on the stock exchange. Rangers must have done the same If they were ever a plc. Rangers football club will cease to exist when they are liquidated. Green will then start a brand new company which will attempt to join the scottish league. The league will vote on it. However as the company will be debt free it will receive sanctions to avoid it gaining an advantage over existing clubs some of who's debt will be as a result of rangers liquidation. There are no similarities to celtic in 1994 who did not default on debts and continued with the same accounts as before.

12 Jun 2012 16:28:48
so mister green send out letters to season ticket holders asking us to send him our money for season tickets even tho we do not no where we will be playing or what players we will have he can forget it any1 at send him money just now is off there head he stands to make a very good profit out this deal grabing up all rangers assets and no debt this is always the way he wanted to get rangers as we are now debt free and he will sell to new owners after 1 or 2 year even if that long

It's more than we don't know where we will be playing we don't know IF we will be playing.

Rangers FC Plc 1899 are liquidated. Green didn't own that company/ club and it can no longer trade.
A new company/ club with board of directors, owning footballing assets has not been set up. Once up and operational, that NEW club can start to sell tickets under its new corporate identity at companies house.

12 Jun 2012 16:24:20
So whats to stop anyone coming in with 20mill buying the assests then closing down the club?

GDog
WATP

Why would somebody buy the assets and close down the business. Do you think they can sell the assets for a profit, not a chance, the green bid will go thru by Friday, the big question is that they have no players, now all free agents.
Ibrox and The training ground are in the books at £100m plus, but only worth what somebody will pay, and it seems from HMRC statement that they will not stand in way of Greens purchase.
According to Green they have paid most of £5m already, and Duffs statement seems to back that up.

Nothing. But there is still a value to the club, so the Rangers name, SPL share etc will be sold to the highest bidder. Which would likely be Green as things stand, unless we see the Blue Knights riding back in again (as many here predict).

Green cannot buy the assets until the end of the 28 day cooling off period 12th July. {Ed039's Note - There will be no cooling off period as the club will be liquidated before then, it can not afford to carry on in its current form)

Bdo are the liquidators.

I am merely trying to make a point that everyone seems to think Green will gain the club, however it's a new game with new rules. Anyone can come back in and it may not be someone with the right intentions!

The club now no longer belongs to the fans, I'm sorry but today marks the day we ALL lost Glasgow Rangers.

GDog
WATP

12 Jun 2012 15:58:43
The liquidator has powers to examine the governance and administration of the club before its insolvency and report on any issues he feels should be raised with creditors.

Among these powers, include the right to apply for a court order to examine, under oath, people involved with the company.

Hmrc has played a blinder here. As a taxpayer i'm pleased that there will be an investigation. Its easily tbe best way to deal with this. Squeeky bum time at the castle and Charlotte square.

Cohen, one of the joint liquidators states they will seek to "protect any remaining assets, maximise recoveries for the benefit of creditors, and investigate the reasons behind the failure of the company". So it looks like Green won't be getting them for £5.5m.
Al

The club is liquidated so nothing from BDO about protecting the club..... It's finished. D&P always talked about protecting thd club to continue trading.

So guess all employees are made redundant.

12 Jun 2012 15:50:44
ed what happens with the big tax case now {Ed039's Note - By the sounds of the statement from HMRC the Newco will continue without fear of litigation and they will pursue the persons responsible)

I for one still want to know the outcome of the big tax case. If rumour has it more than Rangers had EBT's and everyone should be treated the same. {Ed039's Note - There are many more than Rangers used this over the years, Rangers are not unique in this)

At last somebody talking a bit of sense! BTC means little or nothing for Rangers now, only people that should be worried about it are SDM and the other former Directors etc. Newco is the best thing that could've happened IMO, no more debt, no more looming court cases, a newco and a new start!

12 Jun 2012 15:47:32
If Rangers lose the BIG tax case as expected.....does that mean HMRC can gain the assets and retrospectively sell them off to the highest bidder? Meaning even the owner of a potential newco would have to bid for Ibrox/Murray Park/players etc.....

They dont have to win any thing.they can do that now

12 Jun 2012 15:46:50
HMRC refuse to enter in to CVA talks with rangers football club? Scotlands most historic football team destroyed to show to other companies that they cant get away with this? Rubbish! Where is the tax case for the big epl clubs? Where is the tax case for the ftse 500 companys that steal billions but get away with it? The westminister Whitehall tax office has decied to sacrifice rangers not because its the right thing to do, but because the media interest is to high and when was the last time they donated money to a political party anyway? Truth is rangers dont matter to them, they only care about greed!
Vote snp
RFC#1

It is the right thing to do and should have been done months ago.

You're missing the point. There won't be a published Decision; it's not in HMRC interest to make public a deal that will be settled privately. Only interest is in public purse, as it should be.

12 Jun 2012 15:38:59
Now that it is Liquidation, can we as fans stop all support for this new charlatan Green. I would rather the club ended up in the 3rd Division under Fan Ownership via the Blue Knights or someone with the club at heart, rather than struggling along in the SPL with two nooses round the clubs neck (the SPL sanctions and the 8% interest charge for Green).

While the bulk of the blame has to go to Murray for the mess he created, you just have to wonder whether some one else has been behind Green and Whyte, along with the catalogue of blows aimed at Rangers over the past 5 years. From the UEFA Race Fines, the HMRC focus on Rangers first when there are bigger EPL fish to fry, finalised by Whyte and D&P�s seemingly concerted efforts to cause as much harm and damage as possible prior to and during administration. I just dread to think what new hell Green or his unknown backers may be planning.

Let�s get Rangers back to the fans, and we can build a club we are again proud to support from the bottom up!

I for one would pay for a 3 year season ticket at double the price of the current annual ticket to see the club financed from the 3rd division through to the SPL, but only if it is owned by True Rangers fans. With this money we can blood young players with some experience from each division to regain our SPL place, and potentially build a team worth playing in the SPL when we get back.

12 Jun 2012 15:35:36
Pre season friendly v Arsnal first league matc v Annan

12 Jun 2012 15:32:03
OK - now that we are going into liquidation.
Mr Green said on Sunday (Sunday Herald & Sunday Mail) that he would announce the names of his financial backers either when they agreed the CVA or went to Newco.
Let's hear them Mr. Green.

12 Jun 2012 15:26:01
Is there any wonder HMRC have knocked back the CVA proposal when Charles Green is spouting that he will has a backer to buy the naming rights at Ibrox and he has a war chest for Ally to spend?

Surely the money he has for the naming rights and any money he can raise to spend on players should be added to the pot to at least give a better offer to creditors and make it look like they are making an effort to pay back debts.

Even if he did want to keep money aside surely the last thing you would do is starting spouting what you'll have in the press before the CVA has went through.

I smell a rat and feel that this was their preferred option all along.

The Pilot!

You don't say...

It does look that way. Cant believe green is getting rangers for 5.5m. Thats only tore André flo from the waist up.

12 Jun 2012 15:19:10
No more Rangers. This is a very sad day for me and doubtless all other Teddy Bears.

One question that I don't get (maybe you can tell me ed, or other posters) is the HMRC rejection is based on this years failure to pay rates alone, or is it including the BTC.

Doesn't really matter, jobs f***ed now anyway. {Ed039's Note - They say it was to allow a newco to continue without fear of litigation and it allows them to persue the persons responsible)

12 Jun 2012 15:16:14
RIP old friend.

Your likes will never be seen again and I'll never forget you.

Feels like a member of my family has passed away.

12 Jun 2012 14:42:55
Rangers to have vote in whether SPL should admit Newco to SPL. - Ed, how can RFC (In Admin) possibly vote for RFC (2012)? {Ed039's Note - As far as I am aware it is the other 11 SPL member clubs)

12 Jun 2012 14:58:03
The worst day of my football life, but at least one thing is clear from HMRC they are going after Murray & Whyte, it looks as if they may get what they deserve.

I cant believe what is going on at your club,rangers fans are some of the best lads i have ever ever ever met,i cant imagine what you are going through at this moment but one thing guys you will be back as the pride of scottish football soon.Am an everton fan and av allways liked rangers.Terry blue

12 Jun 2012 14:07:30
so thats rangers going into liquidation,so does that mean the etb saga is irrelivant?dougs

12 Jun 2012 14:50:33
to all thre rangers fans saying that this keeps their history intact you are wrong.rangers history ends today and you start again at nothing you lose.this cannot be disputed.over-indulgence and spending what you didnt have has brought this day upon you.the rangers name will continue but under no circumstances can it be said that your history remains intact.

on the bright side i envy alot of you rangers fans because the next time you win the league you will be able to say you were there for the first-even if it is in division 3!

Agree, as a Rangers fan I now admit that our history stops on the day we enter liquidation. We should start off in Div 3 as a new club, I as a fan now have the choice to support this club or not as the club I have loved and supported ceases to trade once we go into liquidation.

Other problems may be Tv rights etc as on the same day that Rangers die the "old firm" dies with it as the next time Rangers & Celtic play it will be Celtic vs Rangers(newco) for the 1st time.

The Pilot!

History is intact the football club plc 1899 is to be liquidated the part of the business that has been going on for 140 years lives on wether in div 3 we will wait and see

Good post and correct.
Rangers FC plc incorporated 1899 is to be liquidated. All history ceased and a new incorporated company started.
Later the records will be adjusted to remove the titles from the illegal years where players were fielded illegally. 2000-2003 inclusive just for starters.

12 Jun 2012 14:46:47
do duff and duffer still get paid?
will murray lose his knighthood?
will craig whyte be charged with tax evasion?
can anyone now enter the bidding for the club or does greene recieve priority?

12 Jun 2012 14:29:25
green shoulda shut his yorkshire gub ,,,but no!!....we have millions to spend he says....well now you got nuthin pal....theres no way he gets ibrox and murray pk and then offloads the lot in 3 years......this was his game all along.....deecee

12 Jun 2012 14:25:02
RANGERS 1872-2012 YOU WERE MY LIFE

12 Jun 2012 14:04:23
If we need to re-apply to the SPL, why can't we just apply to the FA in England?

Because we are Scottish

And, Cardiff and Swansea are welsh! Lpoolkris

Good god, not again!

UEFA Rules state that any club which is applying for membership must play in the country of Association!

End of Story!

Simple, sell Ibrox (everyone keeps saying it's worth a few bob) build a new stadium just over the border and apply for registration. Glory day's to follow. {Ed039's Note - Yes SIMPLES)

Will this ever end ?

12 Jun 2012 14:00:56
i am rangers fan i will always be a rangers fan but i am thinking very hard about this newco im 50/50 whether i will be supporting them with my hard earned cash in an spl where i hate the majority of teams in this mickey mouse league,i just cant get the feeling that a newco will be rangers football club that i supported as a boy
i think it maybe time for travelling to epl games taking in different grounds and teams and just being a football fan, rangers till they died

I with u mate. I don't think it will be the same. No great European nights! No old firm games! No 55th title! Newco will have to start in div 3. Other 10 spl clubs will be short sighted an want to make quick buck by splitting gate money! Good luck to them cos they will really need it!

By EPL, I hope you mean the Easterhouse Pub League, as thats about the level you might get back in at. {Ed039's Note - I played against some right good players in the East Ends pub leagues)

12 Jun 2012 13:52:03
Why is green being allowed to buy the assets for a paultry £ 5.5 million when conservative estimates put the figure at £ 100 million ? I smell a rat here and is is couloured whyte and green !

This 100m figure is ,and has always been,a nonsense.

I'm sure if someone else steps up more money then games on
but at the moment I don't dsee anybody willing to pay £100mil

bil72

Agreed no one will pay £100m but they will paya lot more than £5.5m

Watch this space

12 Jun 2012 13:49:19
I presume that BDO will block the sale to Green and begin the disposal of all assets to pay creditors in proportion if there is enough left after they get their share.

I appreciate the eventual amount of the CVA could have been, say, 2p instead of 9p so it's possible the creditors might slightly more than 2p.

I doubt the SPL clubs will have the courage to ban Rangers from the SPL but the SFA will probably suspend Rangers now in light of the implications of liquidation - ie years of tax evasion etc.

12 Jun 2012 13:47:38
so can anyone now confirm a few points ..

Now that its liquidation & were
going down the newco route

Does this mean the outcome
of the big tax case is irrelvant to
the new Rangers FC?. As well as
any additional punishment the SFA
are looking to hand us down re the
transfer embargo carry on. All we
can hope for is the SFA/SPL and
the clubs vote us back in or
its 3rd Div footie for us. Who in
their right mind is going to buy a
season ticket to watch Annan &
Stranrear? & what players are
going to remain except the young
lads. Add to this no european
football for some considerable time.
What a mess !

Whyte & Murray I hope you get
everything coming to you ! including
a twin bedded room at the Bar L.

12 Jun 2012 13:42:05
My father died at the ibrox disaster, i am really upset at todays news as i am sure are all rangers fans. to be honest i think we all knew it would happen. however wherever we end up playing i will be taking my boy to the gers games. to those who have done this to our club, shame on you.

Im a celtic fan who was at the match in 1971. I hope that the memory of those who died will be carried on in the hearts of the fans of the new Team. You have an opportunity to build a new club which embodies the best of rangers. Im site many lessons can be learned from this debacle.

12 Jun 2012 13:43:02
David Murray and Craig Whyte may you burn in hell for what you have done to my club!

Gers1986

12 Jun 2012 13:25:50
So it's liquidation, doesn't suprise me at all.
This has been the plan of Whyte and D&P since the very beginning. Green has been a smokescreen to divert from the truth, and the truth is that there needs to be a full and very public enquiery into everything that has gone on at Rangers since Murray agreed to sell (and why) to whyte, the involvement of D&P since the beginning and the role that Green was brought in to fill. There was no way the CVA would be accepted and they all knew it, it was just a part of the big plan to liquidate the club from the outset. Everytime it looked like someone was about to step up and buy us, D&P would say or do something to scupper it, Milking it for months to fill their coffers then breaking it up to fill their bosses (Whyte). What has happened is nothing short of criminal and an investigation followed by charges must now happen.
Has D&P made sure the paye and tax has all been paid and accounted for since they took control, and what know happens to the remainder of the fighting fund.
This is a disaster and heads must role for the way it's been handled at the very least.

I agree with most of your points, but I think Rangers were viewed as a poisoned chalice. No one wanted it unless they could get it for pennies. The only people who came in who seemed to have any affinity to the club were the BKs and they went in too low and lost out to CK who offered a little more. However, I doubt the BKs could have gotten a CVA accepted either.
Al

12 Jun 2012 13:23:07
HMRC reject CVA so never mind Rapid Vienna its good night Vienna.

12 Jun 2012 13:21:27
Thats it folks...........Our beloved Glasgow rangers to be liquidated!! HMRC reject CVA, what now for our club?

Now watch every other SPL club kick us when we are down and reject newcow proposals and send us to division 3

Im an Annan Athletic fan and i dont want you in division 3 either!

1. We deserve to go down to division 3. I have said all along liquidation would be the final outcome and we shouldnt therefore be in the SPL. Why should we be different from Livingston and Airdrie? Their fans were innocent as well so lets not feel sorry for ourselves. We welcomed the good times so take our punishment and get on with it. At least down there we will have a chance to build a football playing team suitable for today's style not the tactics of the 80s.

Jackie

12 Jun 2012 13:13:56
HMRC will be going after previous directors (not just CW).

INS44251 - What to investigate and how: Recovery of National Insurance Contributions from directors or other officers (Personal Liability Notices): What is a Personal Liability Notice?
Section 121C Social Security Administration Act 1992
The PAYE and National Insurance legislations require an employer to pay over to HMRC the PAYE and National Insurance Contributions (NIC) due on the earnings of an employee. A company has a statutory obligation to pay the PAYE and Class 1 (NIC) to HMRC within 14 days of the end of the month in which the deductions were made (or 17 days if by electronic method) in respect of employment income paid to its employees. If the correct amount of National Insurance Contributions (NIC) are not paid then Section 121C of the Social Security Administration Act 1992 provides HMRC with the powers to recover unpaid National Insurance Contributions, plus any interest and penalties, from the directors or other officers of the company.

The right to recover applies to all the contributions unpaid, by the company, which have arisen after 6 April 1999, and not just the contributions due in respect of the directors.

The legislation was introduced by Section 64 of the Social Security Act 1998 and came into effect from 6 April 1999. Its purpose is to provide a more timely and cost effective method to tackle abuse of the NIC system, and to act as a deterrent to future abuses and losses to the National Insurance Fund.

The legislation provides that HMRC may issue a Personal Liability Notice where:

A body corporate has failed to pay the ‘contributions’ due at or within the prescribed time
and

That failure is in the opinion of HMRC attributable to the fraud or neglect of one or more individuals who, at the time of the fraud or neglect, were ‘officers’ of the company. Such officers are known as ‘culpable officers’.
In respect of a company the legislation defines ‘officer’ as meaning:

Any director, manager, secretary or other similar officer of the company, or any person purporting to act as such (including shadow directors).
For the purposes of the legislation, contributions include primary and secondary Class 1 NIC, Class 1A NIC, Class 1B NIC and related interest or penalties charged in respect of these contributions.

If the decision is made to issue a Personal Liability Notice, the individual ‘culpable officer’ issued with the notice becomes personally liable for the amount specified in the notice. The individual has the right to appeal against the issue of Personal Liability Notice.

12 Jun 2012 13:11:56
just heard the news hmrc have rejected the cva and it looks like a new co now when is the earliest the spl chairmen vote for admission into the spl?

12 Jun 2012 13:11:38
So - we now know that there will be no CVA. If HMRC are to appoint BDO as liquidators, surely Mr Greens £5.5m asset purchase is just one potential bid and hey'll have to see if they can get more?

Who pays for BDO?
& will this drag on another 6 months?

bil72

Yes, I don't see why the liquidator can't rip up D&P's deal with Green.

Bdo won't take 6months, 6 weeks max {Ed039's Note - There will be a time frame, I dont know about the liquidators ripping up the contract with Green though, I just dont see that happening)

12 Jun 2012 13:08:40
Duff and Phelps have to take the blame for this, if they as adminsistrators had acted like administrators on behalf of the creditors and not on behalf of saving the club, then Mcgreggor, Naismith, Davis, etc could have been sold, not at cut price deals like the arranged but full market value, if the staff had been cut as well and certain assets sold that dont interfere with the running of the club, then there would have been twice as much cash in the pot for a CVA and also they would not have run up 5 mill plus in fees. if the CVA pot was double what was offered then it would have been accepted several months ago, but now with their incompetance and bad managenment and with Green spouting his mouth of about 30 mill and signing players, you could see the creditors have been well and trully shafted. investigations into possible fraud should now be implemented.
D and P have been negligent and incompetant all the way through this, and Green should be prevented from buying the assets at such a ridiculous price and HMRC should have all asserts auctioned off to highest bidders {Ed001's Note - I fully agree with that, D&P have acted with gross negligence, in my opinion, in all this. They must have known that the club had to sell players in January, it should have been the number one priority of an administrator, to raise funds to pay back creditors. By not doing so, they have clearly not acted with the best interests of creditors at heart. Surely creditors must now sue them for monies they are now not going to receive??}

Ed one minor point. D&P were not apointed till after the transfer window had been shut. they could definately have got special permission to sell players outwith the window from EUFA/SFA. but chose not persue that route. In some ways they acted more like (misguided) fans than liquidators and were determined to keep second place in the league.

D&P have been the worst thing. Rangers could have been liquidated 3 months ago (yes, I know the fixtures needed to be completed) and the best part of £5m saved. Wonder if anyone will challenge their bill?

Ed.: they weren't appointed until February. {Ed001's Note - yes, sorry, I meant to say they could have sought permission off UEFA, as they must have known the club had to sell players in January and it didn't. UEFA would have allowed the sales to happen, there are precedents.}

We did not go into admin until transfer window closed, so they could not sell them. {Ed001's Note - yes they could. UEFA will allow sales to happen when a club is in danger of collapse.}

Who could D&P have sold the players to with the European transfer window closed when they came in? I also think they were looking at the club being more attractive to a buyer if the bigger names were still there and better able to finish higher up the table to bring in more money. However, I do think they have been incompetant.
Al

12 Jun 2012 13:03:42
The cva look set to reject cva and Mr green to push ahead with rangers takeover

12 Jun 2012 13:17:33
You really gotta question the sanity of Green.His latest claim is that rangers football club will continue and play at ibrox.How? Rangers football club have been liquidated so a newco cannot be the same entity,he said this the other day.BDO will now assess the assets of rangers and sell them off for maximum return for all creditors.This includes ibrox.Green is starting to look very foolish.

12 Jun 2012 13:03:00
Now that liquidation has finally been decided where does this leave the companies who gave up front payments to rangers? The strips and the catering operation spring to mind,will they now be added to the creditors list? How will this affect the asset sale that will be forthcoming?Mr Green has hardly been shy and retiring so i think he must address fans concerns asap.He has a lot of questions to answer,purchasing the assets,the three year euro ban and re entry to the SFA and SPL being chief amongst them i would think.

12 Jun 2012 12:47:57
Rangers to be Liquidated.

Rangers FC plc incorporated 1899 is to be liquidated.

David Murrays Knighthood is now untenable.

12 Jun 2012 12:43:50
Well bears all i can say is that since my dad took me to my first game 20 year ago i was 5 years old
and ever since followed them home and away and i have enjoyed every minuite of it from getting on the supporters bus to reaching the ground we were playing at. days like winning the league at parkhead to helicopter sunday with the hairs standing on the back of my neck. european nights at ibrox against juventus,galatsaray,monaco barcelona,stuttgart,man utd
the atmosphere at ibrox was amazing.

RANGERS 1872-2012 YOU WERE MY LIFE

12 Jun 2012 12:36:04
HMRC say no to CVA. 140 years and now no more, the tears are running down my cheeks.

12 Jun 2012 12:26:26
Now that the CVA has been rejected by HMRC, ed, does that mean D&P will be removed with HMRC's own liquidators being appointed? Also is there a guarantee that the assets will be sold to Green's consortium for the £5.5m reported in the press. Surely the liquidators have a responsibility to sell to highest bidders in order to get the best deal for creditors....

I really fear that there will be no Rangers in any form after today's news... {Ed001's Note - yes, D&P will now hand over control to the liquidators, they will sell everything for the best price they can get and Rangers, as it is now, will cease to exist.}

Ed, that is not correct the HMRC statement says newco, green will be allowed to but assets as agreed {Ed001's Note - yes, and that will be a new company and the previous one, which is known as Rangers, will cease to exist. What is so difficult to understand? What exactly are you disputing?}

12 Jun 2012 12:24:05
Results just in

Rangers 104 c.HMRC b. C. White & D Murray

12 Jun 2012 12:09:53
Rangers to be liquidated as HMRC have rejected the CVA. (BBC) Feel sorry for the fans but your history is now broken and reputation forever in the gutter. SDM should be chased from the land and stripped of knighthood.

Nothing stays in the gutter apart from the gutter!

As soon as success comes back and the club begin to grow again, all will be in the past.

Whether we are in the 3rd or Prem. It will make no difference.

And dont be so sure we will be rejected for next season as sadly money talks.

I for one would leave for the 3rd and sau to hell with you all.

GDog
WATP

12 Jun 2012 12:06:44
charles green says hmrc have said they will reject cva and he now wants fans to buy season tickets to bankroll the club through the summer it is now clear this guy has no money or him and his investors would surely anti up time for this charlatan to f### off .... pay at the gate if there is one futf

Where does he say he want fans to buy season books in his latest statement

12 Jun 2012 11:55:29
Ally McCoist had his phone hacked by News of the World. If they done him odds on they did Whyte, SDM, Alastair Johnston, Martin Bain, Dave King, Gary Withey, Ellis and others.
To get stories you'd think they'd hack other journos phones too: Jackson, Traynor, chick Young,....

There's a lot going to come out...........

Wouldn't get many facts from hacking those journalists' phones ;)

Ally's phone may have been hacked, I doubt the reporters phones have been hacked cause they never printed an honest story a bout Rnagers in their lives!

12 Jun 2012 11:51:17
Well looks as though the show is over as Glasgow Rangers. If anything good comes out of this the statement from HMRC says that by rejecting the CVA they will now go for the individuals responsible for running OUR club into the ground.DAVID MURRAY HANG YOUR HEAD IN SHAME....I hope you get everything that is coming to you

12 Jun 2012 11:44:21
Don't know how much truth is in this but it's all over Facebook sayin HMRC are to refuse the CVA proposed by mr. Green. If this is true then it's a sad sad day for all connected to Rangers. Heard anythin ed? Apparently all over BBC website

Big GL {Ed039's Note - True)

12 Jun 2012 11:37:31
Ssn article saying hmrc to refuse cva deal! More bad news everyday!

Dublinbear

12 Jun 2012 11:33:10
HMRC statement just released:

Rangers liquidation gives best chance to protect taxpayers and allows sale of club to a new company, ensuring football continues at Ibrox.

Liquidation allows potential investigation and claims against those responsible for company's recent finances.

CVA would restrict action against those responsible for company's recent finances.

Its the end of an era

& the start of a new one ;-)

bil72

12 Jun 2012 08:24:00
hi the justice wheel is turning rapid have went public with a statment through eufa that it will not take what is on the table ,and to all that dont know what that meens is come this time next month ther will be no more rangers fc as we know, your history will cease and before you jump to the timmy shouts im a hearts fan and it goes to show you that cheats never prosper ,marty the tarty {Ed001's Note - cheats never prosper? You mean like Paolo Rossi, lifetime ban for match fixing, which is rescinded to allow him to play in a World Cup for Italy, which they then won, with the help of him, a proven match fixer. Funnily enough, after another match fixing scandal, implicated players helped Italy to win the World Cup again. Cheats have always prospered in football, unfortunately.}

Listen lets get one thing straight our history will not be going anywhere. ITS THERE, DONE! It CANT BE REMOVED.

We will however not be able to add to it. Thats the tragedy!

Mistakes do not make you a cheat. Intention does and of course Whyte is guilty of that.

Just leave, and go and gloat with your own kind on your own site.

GDog
WATP

12 Jun 2012 10:52:36
***Leading football finance expert Neil Patey of Ernst & Young believes key indicators are now pointing towards Rangers achieving a CVA with key creditors HMRC and Ticketus*** Looks like the expert got it wrong hmrc will not accept cva.....

12 Jun 2012 10:50:10
Bears

Is it just me or do any of you think this guy Green is blowing smoke up everyone's bum? He talks about the 19 players he has on a list...he talks about raising millions...he talks about sorting your club out and leaving within a year.
Is this naive talk on his part causing you concern? I'd be concerned if he were talking about my club.

ChrisBhoy

11 Jun 2012 22:10:40
Ed039 I seen down the page J1985 having a rant about not wanting gattuso & about next season just having a club & from your comment I take it you agree with him, I also agree 2 a certain extent but I would take gattuso instead of the imposter of a captain we have in our midfield any day, as some 1 else said gattuso would be great at bringing the young boys through & he has said if he is not up 2 standards he would rip up his contract if davis can go for £1.65 mill then let him because as far as I am concerned the ones that had these clauses written into their contracts are bang out of order & I think big jig has said as much, I can understand the foreign guys but the so called RANGERS fans do me a favour, I have slaughtered big jig on here at times but he is further up my ladder than any of these a**eholes,one last note J1985 says next season is just about having a club correct but if somethings go our way like we can keep our top players & we can sign some players,tell me who are the manks going 2 sign that will make them run away with the title correct no 1
NTYABOW {Ed039's Note - I wouldn't mind seeing gattuso in a rangers shirt but I am more interested in the long term sustainability of the club, a few hallowed years bringing through youth is the way to do that. I also feel after financial misgivings flashing a world cup winner would win us no favours in trying to gain some sort of respectability back)

Haven't had a lot of 'leadership' from our captain, on or off pitch - throughout all of this sorry mess imo!

bil72

What a stupid post.What does it matter if you are a rangers fan,does your families welfare not come first?

11 Jun 2012 23:31:17
The biggest week in our club's history. We may have less than three days left, 140 years of history, some very good, some great wins, some horrible awful losses. We have an enormous following and have never seen anything like Manchester. Looking from my room in the Picadilly overlooking the square, it was the most unbelievable sight.

However I shall also not forget the sight later that
Night when a car had been pushed into a wall. I met
a Police officer and told him of the car. I got a told in no uncertain terms that this was a result of our so called fans.

I went back to the hotel and watched in disgust at the tv pictures, and felt so badly let down again by this moronic element that we seem to attract, the same yobs who spout the sectarian dross no doubt. Whatever our future I hope to goodness that these morons go elsewhere.

I have cried when fans lost their lives, I have felt as sick as a parrot at some losses, but I have to say life will not be the same without them, I have enjoyed success and hope there is more to come. I have celebrated victories and have had forty five years of watching them. I have been there when there was nobody within twenty yards of you, per Souness. I never thought for one minute that we would be in a worse position than that, and yet here we are facing the biggest week of our life, which we may not successfully see the weekend.

And why are we in this mess, because of over inflated egos, greed, and some very shonky business practices. How dare these people treat my club in this way, they have brought embarrasment, despair, and disgust, may they forever hang their heads in shame.

I have a real strong feeling that neither Murray or Whyte give a monkey's toss and they will be sitting in France enjoying the good life.

Three days.

A true post from a true rangers man!!pity there not more like you around m8..stevo

Murray did all he did for Rangers Fans. He fed the ego of the beast which was the fans.

Great post from a true ger. Kudos.

Yes. He did #2.
But i also remember Celtic fans booing their saviour for not investing millions on players.
So was this a self righteous lack of ego,or ambition on their part?
Do you remember the wee man in the bunnet?
P.O.B.