Rangers Banter Archive December 13 2013

 

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13 Dec 2013 14:38:31
Opinion is split on most things to do with our team, so here is another one to throw into the melting pot. Our best and worst managers.
Since my first game in 1955, I have seen teams managed by 11 different managers [Smith and Wallace twice. ]
Le Guen was not there long enough to judge, so here are my top and bottom 3.
1. Sounness. 2. Wallace 3. Advocaat
8. Davie White 9. Greig. 10. McCoist.
So once the Murray's go with their tails between their legs and stability reigns, I hope we could get Sounness back as Director of football and then, in my opinion, he would sort out the coaching side.
billyb

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Very surprised you have Souness at No 1. What makes him better than Smith?

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Down to opinion Stewie, but I always felt that Walter Smith was too negative. [where did Ally learn his 1 up front tactic?].
In my opinion, it was the main factor behind us not achieving 10 in a row.
He got us to the final in Manchester with that negativity, but it is hard to win against class teams on a one off basis with that attitude.
Against Zenit, in that final, there was a total feeling of despair in the stadium that night because of our approach to a cup final.
billyb

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Great question

1. Struth. no idea about football we played but the record tells me everything.

2. Advocaat. simple he had Rangers playing european level home and away the best I ever saw a Rangers team in my life.
3. Big Jock the attitude the fitness the trebles a real Rangers man.

4. Walter. 9 in a row and actually the three in a row with wee squad and best team fighting spirt like the 1992 team

5. Alec McCleish. just ahead of Souness for the titles we won against the odds due to Aberdeen connection underappreciated
6. Souness. his influence and signings of england goalie and captain great but his treatment of player like Roberts with no room for negotiation I did not like. the "get it right up ye" factor was great too Mo Johnston being the biggest signing in our history love/hate it the wind up and his goal last min against tims PRICELESS memories
7. Willie Waddell. should be higher but really stoping the 10 in a row why he is in top 10

8. Big John the greatest ever Ranger. hate to say it but lie Ally wasn't manager material

9. Le Guen ONLY for not controlling the dressing room he couldn't win with Barry up against him. sad as he would possibly have been our best ever.

10. Easiest pick. simply put in every facet from ability. dignity and two faced lies to fans he is the worst manager in our history and will probably be for next 200 years. ahm not biased honest

george

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Billyb

Fair point mate and can't really argue with your points about Smith. Was at the UEFA cup final and your right our approach was awful. Think if Souness had stayed rather than leave for Liverpool he could have been our best manager. Team was good to watch and played good football. Can't see him returning though his time is past at Rangers

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George

Good post and hard to argue about nearly all of your points especially point 10. As for Le Guen he made a grave error in totally underestimating the Scottish game. Also by the time the Ferguson situation happened he was already planning his exit.

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George, were you about to see the teams under Scot Symon and Davie White? Symon was in the Struth mould, where the attitude was '' We are Rangers so go out and be a credit to the jersey. '' With Struth and Symon the senior players made the decisions on the park.
Davie White was more of a coach, and a good one, but although we played quite well he was not part of the 'Rangers establishment' and Waddell crucified him.
Stewie, what about your top three?
billyb

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Wish we had any of them back right now, on Le Guen we will never know since the board, sorry Murray, a total disgrace backing a player against the manager.

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Billyb

I was born 1970 so it's really from Jock Wallace onwards that I can comment on. Smith has the best record of all the managers I remember but as you say Billy he was very negative and the team wasn't the best to watch. Wallace probably had the fittest side ever and even at a young age I can remember the infamous gullane sand dunes. Always felt though that we came up a bit short under Wallace against good footballing sides. Obviously it didn't work our for Greig but in my opinion it was a case of what might have been. I still remember the game at Celtic park when we were 2-1 up late on but managed to lose 4-2 which in effect cost us the league (sure George will remember that game) maybe if Greig's team won the game it could have been oh so different.

Wallace returned but was up against arguably 2 of Scotland's best ever managers in Ferguson and McLean and couldn't recreate the achievements of the first time. Souness had us playing good football and had he been in charge longer I believe he would be up amongst the greats. Advocaat again had us playing great football and our results in Europe improved. Who can forget the game at Ibrox against a talented Parma side. Won a lot of trophies and was the brains behind Auchenhowie however thought he lost the plot against O'Neill and bowed out at the right time.

McLeish again did very well although like Smith was a bit negative. Le Guen came and went Smith was excellent in his 2nd spell getting 3 in a row and getting to a European final. Finally McCoist well u know my feelings on him! So finally my top 3 would have to be:
Smith
Advocaat
Souness

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Ha Stewie REMEMBER it? I had to go through that lass 4-2 50 times.

It was the season we played Hibs 3 times in Scottish Cup final finally winning the 3rd game 3-2 I was at all three Brilliant esp big DJ
At same time the 4-2 game I am sure it was a thursday and there was a tv strike as ONLY bears that were there remember the game before the Bomber og nitemare.
It was brilliant as Doyle was sent off for a bad tackle I think it was on Doddie near centre circle Rangers end of pitch
Just him going off was awesome (for fans that don't remember him imagine Lennon sent off title decider) then we went 1-0 up CHAMPIONIES
After that celtic dominated went 2-1 up I remember Edvaldson got one
The singing was all Championies Tims then Bobby Russell scored with a sot at the D of the Rangers end box 2-2 and INSTANTLY we sining CAMPIOMIES again.
Sadly Big Bomber (Colin Jackson not John Brown) had a mental lapse and it was 3-2 to them

I laft as Murdo MacLeod apparently scored from 35 yds 4-2

What made it worse was just after that at weekend Scotland Lost 3-1 to Argentina with Maradona at 17 taking piss out us (I was there) I got kicked in head playing football, ended up with concussion my memory like a goldfish for 24 hours and worse luck in a bed opposite a tim who got to tell me about 50 times how we lost league soon as he told me I would say F*P as my language was uninhibited too, then go blank for 2 mins and start the whole saga over again

50 times in one weekend losing the league to tims 4-2 that was hell

Funny you say that as if you mind the Juventus and PSV games home and away? Greig had us plying great until Celtic decider then he seemed lose the discipline sad as he was one of my favourite players ever.

Still have all the euro penants from back then in a box somewhere

george

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George

Yes I was lucky enough to be at the Scotland v Argentina game too. Maradona was sensational that day and I feel privileged to have seen such a player in the flesh so to speak. Was also lucky enough to be at the Juventus home game too. What a night that was amazing atmosphere. After the PSV game I really thought we were going to win the European cup. Seem to remember that the Cologne game was postponed on the Wednesday night and had to be played on the Thursday. Also seem to remember a bit of controversy regarding their goal at Ibrox? Your right that team played some good football and I believe that the Celtic result was the difference between success and failure for Greig. Fine margins but that's football

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Yes, both of you are probably right about Greig, but I am still haunted by them singing '10 men won the league trah lahlah lahlah'.
Not long after this I was having a pint with Bomber and some Celtic supporters I knew asked us 'who their top scorer was against us in the last 'x' amount of seasons?'
Answer was big Colin.
Just a blip in some great memories of watching the famous Glasgow Rangers.
billyb

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Yeh the Cologne game was played I was there during the day with hundreds of bears cleaning the snow of the pitch shame maybe better we hadn't!

I think that year and the Marseille years were the 2 times we could have won the EC.

Malmo actually made the final that year and we would have been playing Forrest in a battle of Britain semi which as you see with us and Celtic Leeds games we do tend to raise our game against british/english opponents.

A lot of the Euro games were luck of draw back then, Celtic were a great team back then but had teams like Vojovdina? and Ujpest Doza? Who? in the quarters and semis of EC though funny when they lost it they played Basle Benfica Fiorentina and Leeds BEFORE the final v Feynoord.

Luck does play a part sadly I can only ever see us maybe doing a run in the Europa the way the financial balance of power is now. Do not think Rangers or Celtic will ever reach a CL semi far less the final again.

george

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12 Dec 2013 23:46:15
We are all now beginning to see that our manager ally mccoist has built a very decent team here, most of his signings are most definitely proving to be very good astute players for rangers, as I've continued to say all along mccoist most definitely deserves at the very least the chance to take us back to the scottish premiership because at NO time in our great history has a rangers manager had to put up with or come through what ally has had to deal with, end of story, fact, he has been the glue that's held our great institutional football club together throughout this very dark period in our history and all of what I've stated here is why mccoist has my full backing and should have the backing of the majority of the rangers supporters which I'm sure he has, get right behind our manager!BIG BOYDY9!

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13 Dec 2013 09:50:46
I got chatting about Rangers to my brother in law at the weekend and he asked why I was so sure that the current board had enough votes to stay in control at Ibrox and I answered him that Ally had spoken out in the press about voting for them, presumably all arranged by Media House.

If Ally suspected the Requisitioners had a chance of sweeping to power he would have kept quiet.

As for holding Rangers together through the bad times, if Ally had walked do you really imagine we'd have just have fallen apart? A institution with our history? What a ridiculous thought. All Ally has done is helped the Spivs prolong our misery and very well paid for doing that he has most certainly been.

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Sorry to burst your bubble mate, I remember him the last time in the premier League, he throw away a massive points lead got us put out europe by 2 pub teams, he is not good enough end of story, and it was the money that was keeping him at Ibrox during all the trouble,

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It saddens me that some people can't see McCoist for what he is namely a very poor manager. His team haven't done anything that u wouldn't expect given the gulf in wages paid in contrast to the teams in the league we are in. The current team would struggle to make top 6 in the top division and once again Ally has discarded youth in favour of ageing journeymen. What's happened to McKay? Why when comfortably ahead of Forfar does he bring on Cribari? Why constantly have Smith on the bench? He goes on about being short of a striker and needing to get one in so why not promote a young player and give him run outs at home?
There is no longterm plan by Ally it's all about getting back to the top league but then what. McCulloch, Daly and Black won't be good enough when we reach the too league but there is no evidence that their replacements are being groomed. Next seasons championship may see Hearts, Kilmarnock, Falkirk, Dundee and Dunfermline there and all seem to have better youth development than us. Sorry but Ally isn't the answer and I fear that only when we are back in the top league and are miles behind Celtic will some people realise how bad he is. Bad manager on a ridiculous salary.

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Stewie you really talk some mince. Ally is a poor manager and the only reason we are winning is because we have superior players and a massive wage bill compared to the teams around us. Sorry to break it to you Einstein but when we were winning our 9 in a row we were doing it with superior players and a massive wage bill compared to all the teams around us so therefore in your logic Walter smith must be a rubbish manager to cause he could only win with the best players and highest wages just like ally. He failed miserably at Everton and did no better at international level. We will always have better players and higher wage bills than all other Scottish clubs except Celtic. As for not finishing top six in the spell you are surely on the wind up honestly what are the mighty six teams who would keep us out. Stop talking mince and engage your brain before talking nonsense. Yes ally ain't a great manager but stop typing nonsense just to try and get your point across.

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To@1, 2 and 3 would you want you as a fan if you were a Rangers player? look up fan (short for fanatic) in the dictionary you don't really fit the criteria. If we got Mourinho in could he get us 4 points for a win? could he get us Torres or Lampard in on a free? Would he have walked when things fell appart around him? We will never know but one thing is fact, Ally stayed with our team and has put a good looking football playing team together for little or no transfer budget. You seem to be waiting for us to slip up so you can vent your spleen on our manager. Support our team it feels great.

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George here. Ally I have said I do not admire in any way. that said one thing Walter used to say is massive. a winning mentality. I have to be honest and say the pro Ally boys are correct in one thing IF he keeps on winning YOU CANNOT sack him especially if it perchance continues to SPFL. I honestly do not think it will BUT they are right I am wrong you must at least let him really **** up with HIS OWN team.

One point I would make about how easy we are winning this league. Every match is literally a cup game for these teams especially in the first half of the season. If you analyse the Scottish Cup earlier rounds when the "diddy" teams play the big boys of SPFL there are countless upsets home and away, Celtics not doing the treble once yet since Rangers did an 'Elvis", plus the teams that have beaten them AND other SPFL teams shows that Rangers winning effectively 20 cup tie games in a row is on that basis a phenomenal record. I had not thought of this angle till recently.

Anyone reading my posts over last year knows I am no Ally Fanclub Member. but fair is fair. IF he keeps winning and IF he can say get us to the Scottish Cup Final I can only applaud him. I remember the boos when he first signed as a player and one thing, possibly his only redeeming feature he is a fighter. I wait in hope as truth be told Rangers winning is my only desire.

george

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Pat you can throw personal insults at me all you want that's fine. However when did Smith's team have such a massive advantage over the rest of teams in the league? Can you please name another team in Europe that has such a huge advantage? You admit yourself Ally ain't a great manager so why should the fans have to settle for someone like that? That statement totally defeats any argument you may have had. His record in the cups has been nothing short of embarrassing. Maribor, Malmo, Falkirk, QOS and not forgetting the mighty Forfar and being hammered by Dundee Utd (twice) and Inverness. Also squandering a 15 point lead. Still you go on and have cheap shots at me instead of coming back with sensible arguments.

You have been quite selective too regarding my post. What about my points about youth players and the disappearance of McKay is that mince too? Take it I am talking nonsense about that too?

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@5 your totally missing the point. Why is it that then that any Celtic fan I speak to is overjoyed that Ally is in charge? I want Rangers to return to the top and win the league and I honestly don't see it under Ally. Do you? I am not any less of a fan just because I don't rate him. You'll find that all fans from every team don't rate certain players or managers. Are they not fans either? Can you honestly say that you have been happy with every player or manager at the club since you have been following them and have never criticised them?

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Pat

Also you will find that second time around Walter didn't have a superior wage bill to Celtic and yet managed to win the league. So please if your going to get personal with me then at least get your facts right

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Stewie where was the personal insult about. As for me getting my facts right why don't you get yours right during the nine in a row years Celtic were a mess they nearly ended up the same way we are just now. As for the wages and players we were signing players like gazza and laudrup and paying wages of 15 to 20grand a week back in 95. So yes Walter had a massive advantage over all the other teams simple fact. You spouting nonsense and personal insults at ally just because you don't like him is a bit school boy attitude if you ask me.

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@10

Well the sarcastic references to Einstein are personal insults. What personal insults have I made against the manager? As for the wage bill argument. Currently our wage bill is more than 100 times bigger than any of the teams we are facing. When under Smith was that the case? Also u have failed to come up with another team in Europe who enjoys that same big advantage. Also u have failed to take me to task on the lack of youth players at Ibrox. Actually you haven't made 1 argument to prove that what I have said is nonsense. Maybe you aren't aware if what that word means?

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Stewie and Pat

You need to bin the insults I was on here about 6 months and took the hump at insults but after a year or so you realise its just an opinion on a laptop with Taggart on repeat on London TV so not that big a deal

Better to agree to disagree and agree on Rangers fans end of

I am only interested in us getting back to SPFL fed up to F**K with boardroom, I think the unity Craig of SoS has managed to achieve in the support will mean any board will have to represent the FANS better or they will lose lots of bums on seats

Leaving it to that and hpfly common sense we need stability maybe we will get the board I wand 3 from Easdales 3 with King who knows

22 in a row is an achievment if you see my post about Scots Cup wee teams beating SPFL teams regular so McCoists run IS a big deal in that respect he is playing cup ties every week

george

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Stewie and Pat

You need to bin the insults I was on here about 6 months and took the hump at insults but after a year or so you realise its just an opinion on a laptop with Taggart on repeat on London TV so not that big a deal

Better to agree to disagree and agree on Rangers fans end of

I am only interested in us getting back to SPFL fed up to F**K with boardroom, I think the unity Craig of SoS has managed to achieve in the support will mean any board will have to represent the FANS better or they will lose lots of bums on seats

Leaving it to that and hpfly common sense we need stability maybe we will get the board I wand 3 from Easdales 3 with King who knows

22 in a row is an achievment if you see my post about Scots Cup wee teams beating SPFL teams regular so McCoists run IS a big deal in that respect he is playing cup ties every week

george

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