Use our rumours form to send us rangers transfer rumours.
18 Jun 2012 22:26:32
Does any1 else think the administrators never provided the info on the ebt's/dual contracts to let the newco setup in the hope the punishments wouldnt carry over
D&P are like Whyte. Very economical with facts (and that's being polite).
18 Jun 2012 22:18:25
Celtic Fan here, just want to say that even though your club is going through its toughest ever period I feel for all the genuine fans. I will admit that I have hated Rangers ever since I can remember but purely for football reasons and not for religious reason, I have many friends who are Rangers fans and religion has never been an issue between us, my father is a Catholic and my mother is Protestant and I love them both the same.
I won't lie I think Rangers will not be in the SPL next season and rightly so for the crimes they have committed. But I hope that in the future you will be back with the stable board your club deserves and our rivalry (hopefully with sectarianism eradicated) will once again be the best in the world.
18 Jun 2012 22:14:03
Back to talking football ( I know Me?)
anyway if Ally is your manager next
season in whatever guise your team
are called or whatever league..
do you think he is capable of being a
decent manager? The jury is well and
truly out so far although maybe the
3rd division is his level. Timalloy
18 Jun 2012 22:04:50
On a lighter note, the timmys seem happy we were sunk by Green & White. we know better;
We were in the RED.
Taken over by WHITE.
Now were feeling BLUE.
RANGERS TILL I DIE !
Lol, like how you can still laugh at yourself...on top of the green and white you had celik, couldnt be more wiered if you try, seems though your club is trying
18 Jun 2012 21:48:40
In 1952 Rangers and Celtic stood side by side in the flag flying saga which engulfed Scottish football.
The primary reason behind Rangers decision was purely financial.
Here we are 70 years on and Celtic are about to repay this gesture by voting to keep Rangers in the SPL, again purely financial reasons.
Watch this space.
60 years man, Im old enough as it is.
Celtic bailed out rangers in the 30s
18 Jun 2012 21:36:18
SLY Sports won't pull the plug on Scottish football if Rangers aren’t in the SPL
Aye but it won't be anywhere near the terms it is with rangers in it.
18 Jun 2012 21:33:24
Rangers will keep their history which puts the myths the majority of Celtic fans have to bed.
Of course they will.but the club that earned the history will be dead.Like Third Lanark.Your new rangers cant add to it...........green jhedi
Please don't start all that yet again.How many times do we need to go over this.Get a life!
So then i assume that you are willing to accept all the punishments right? so i guess you wont be on hear saying how can they punish yous.
18 Jun 2012 20:55:13
Can anyone tell me why HMRC are not going after the players and boardmen of RFC. After all , they were the ones who benefitted from the fraud
Paul Belfast
How did the players benefit? They did nothing illegal.
They are going after them. They are already sniffing around Barry ferguson, Nacho Novo and Graeme Souness
18 Jun 2012 21:15:27
Thats a very commendable aspiration. Youd think in 2012 it would be easy with most people not involved with religion. I think the bigot situation got worse in the seventies with the ni problems, but now even that has moved on. I think the law should be used against them even more. It worked with drunk driving and seat belts. Its inexcusable to behave like that in public now.
18 Jun 2012 19:43:47
After all the opinions on the current situation, I heard the most sensible statement from a director of the old regime '' the only way forward is for investment on a non commercial basis.'' And from a man that has been conned by murray, yes, Dave King.
If we can get commitment on that basis the support will give 100% backing to the newco.
The only way to progress is with a united front and any in-fighting is behind closed doors.
Dave King's statement is the most worrying thing I've heard. He wants Rangers to spend more than it earns, not to balance income and expenditure and he wants generous benefactors to write off huge sums over 3 years (obviously not his money). Insane or what?
Yes it insane. But that where rangers are. They need a £10-15 million pound injection every year. To make that cut would mean more than halving your wage bill. But if you do that then it is likely that your income reduces too. You would loose almost all your first team. If you go down to the third and or have financial penalties imposed then it gets even bleaker. As King says the only way to make Rangers pay is sell of land and in particular sell of Ibrox. Green thinks he can make Rangers pay, what does that suggest? If the likes of King and Smith are worried you should be too.
18 Jun 2012 19:46:01
July 4th 2012,remember the date,when the week willed,week kneed chairmen of the other SPL clubs,all join hands and pray they make the right decision,not for all Scottish football,but for the very clubs they represent,thats the dilemma they face,Yes,Rangers have to punished,but how far do they need to go.They have to do the walking,as they have all been doing the talking,interesting times ahead.
18 Jun 2012 19:16:49
SPL will charge newco over non-contractual payments
http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/rangers/106736-spl-will-charge-newco-rangers-on-non-contractual-payments/
How on earth can a new company be liable for an old company's mismanagement?
Because you want to use that old companies share and like everything it comes with a price
Briggs
Teams could break the rules by using ebts etc., spend loads of money they don't have, liquidate then start again without punishment...
Well, they want the old co's SPL share, don't they?
18 Jun 2012 18:42:31
EXCLUSIVE: Sky won't fall: TV giants insist SPL deal is on - even without Rangers
By JOHN MCGARRY
Sky has rubbished claims it is set to pull the plug on Scottish football if Rangers are not playing in the top flight next season.
Notice you omitted the following;
An improved £80m five-year deal, to supercede the existing agreement, remains unsigned and, barring a remarkable turn of events, looks likely to remain so.
also;
'If Rangers are not in the SPL, that would change things for us, naturally. It would leave a quality hole in Scotland’s top division. Competition would deteriorate and, in that event, we would have to renegotiate.
you really are a plonker Rodney
It's all propaganda about Sky pulling the plug.Trying to scare the clubs.It's on very good authority now so no more nonsense about that.
Lol, selective reading I think that's called pal. Did they not say they would have to re-negotiate ? Unless you think of course in timmyland their going to double the 80m?
Sky and the fans don't worry about Rangers.
The Rangers team, if one can be put together will consist of guys costing £200k at most. Not much entertainment anyway. The £14m and above team on the park has finished. Rangers are not offering a good watchable product on the field going forward.
@1&3.....seems you have selective reading as well for they did not say that they were pulling out, they will negociate a new deal so they are saying they are not pulling out but would sign a new deal. and going by how the dead club was playing last season im sure they were going to negociate....and the league was suppose to be over in Nov...how did that work out?
18 Jun 2012 15:54:49
maybe u can clear this up ED , but do Derry who are from the north so are british not play in the irish league ? and Derry are not that long in exsistance ,plz clear up ED TY {Ed001's Note - I have answered this question numerous times. Ireland is a special case, you can be born in Northern Ireland, but play for the Republic of Ireland, even if your entire family have always been from the north and vice versa.}
It's part of their very unique history.Yes,Ed,you must get so fed up repeating yourself. {Ed001's Note - we delete numerous similar questions as well, it gets tiresome!}
Derry City are one of the oldest clubs in Ireland . They were origonally in the Irish League (Northern Ireland ) but due to sectarian trouble between them and Linfield they left/ were thrown out of the Irish League and joined the League of Ireland (republic of Ireland). This was carried out due to the exceptional circumstances. Check the history books, they have won a lot in the Irish League.
It's my understanding that anyone born in Northern Ireland who wants an Irish passport is entitled to one. Regardless of race creed or colour.
The south recognizes all from the north as Irish.
That is correct,garlar07
18 Jun 2012 18:34:08
Ed what titles would we lose if stripped of titles from 2001 to 2010? {Ed039's Note - Depends, are we just talking league titles, league titles in 03,05,09,10. Scottish Cup 02, 03, 08, 09. League Cup 02, 03,05,08,10. Just dont know so its all just speculation at the moment??)
18 Jun 2012 17:57:48
Not a rumour but a Fact, This nonsense has to stop now, A decision on who is taking us forward has to be agreed this week be it Green, Smith or both. it has to be settled in order for us to go forward united as one.
Dividing the support could cause untold damage and could possibly prevent us from fielding any team at all next season.Time is running out. We need to put a team together then find out how they will be paid before we can even apply to join any league. All our focus has to be on a united front going forward together or we might end up with no team at all to support next season.
DD.
18 Jun 2012 17:33:30
Honestly can any1 see rangers getting voted in to play in the spl next season?
All the scum....gs want is a pound of flesh,their all leeches,dont care what they do to us we will be back,we aint going anywhere....blue till i snuff it,stuff you all.....trueblue.......
Yes everyone is out 2 get us pay for your crimes and grow up u muppet
Leeches ? All you are is a fan who pays to watch football like any other fan. The only leeches in scottish football are debt defaulting rangers.
@1; Exactly the attitude thats turned every real FOOTBALL fan against you.Listen to the real,decent gers fans on here,theres plenty,they understand the mess your club has created..........green jhedi
An anagram of Charles Green is Rangers Leech.
Yes. In the end the other 11 (i) want the dosh and (ii) don't have the guts to say no.
18 Jun 2012 17:27:48
so all your excuses to stay in the league has been wrong....tv deal will pull out is wrong as they have said, and your not guilt until proven well its proven and your punishment awaits...so whats the next excues for you staying in the league? that the world is flat? that the sky is falling so you need to stay in?
no the next one as i have been readin on your page which comes from within your own club is that everyone hates us and that the hate is because of why? because everyone is Celtic..stop think hate is the reason and stop saying its has to do with ever small aspect of Celtic...there maybe hate but that is because of how you hated and used threats all this time and that your dead club hated every club and ppl of Scotland as they stole ppls money......so whats next for yous to be proven wrong/
Well said m8
A post full of inaccuracies and hate,irony ya trumpet.
To original post, its people like you that should stay away from football, your bile gives decent fans a bad name and shows nothing but hatred towards my club...one sad individual Rangers will live on no matter what is done to us I would go watch them on a public park m8 it wouldnt matter to me...
Tam-Sir 1873 Ed y do you post what these clowns say all the time its a banter page not a hatred page...
Tammy-sir...what are you talking about? im the op and not once did i say i hated your club, and for why does ed post this...read what i said again and then scroll down and look what your own fans post about how everyone hates you for no reason and that it is only hate that they are punishing yous.
i neve said anything which you can call bile for i only repeated what your own fans have said down on the page, so you think ppl that talk sense should stay away from football? so if your a logic thinking person you tell me what you think about what your club has done and do you think the punishments that will be coming out would be because of just hate? or can you take off your blue tainted glasses wake up and see just what your club has done and how many different rules they broke? and if what i said was bile then what do yo think of all the fans and manager calling for the names of the panel ppl which caused them threats, which im guessing going by your post that you think it was ok because your club needs "transparency" or is it ppl"kicking when your down" or whatever your legends would have you believe. i await.
With regards of the original post,is this man for real in trying to make us think he has not bad or hate towards rangers.it was not the club or fan`s who caused this mess.it was a couple of rich men thinking that by doing the taxman out of what he is due,then that is fine.if this was me or you who had done this then i am sure we would be up in front of a judge for tax evasion.although the club has not always done the best for scottish football we are not the only one and we are not the only club to go through administration but we are being continually being punished.every club in scottish football is going to suffer because of a couple if rich men.the SFA have a lot to answer for.this mess would never have been as bad if the SFA had done there jobs in checking "CRAIG WHYTE" out,which is meant to be done.everyone who is going to purchase a club has to go through checks which were obviously not done because everyone but the SFA knew "WHYTE" was a crook.instead of continuously punishing the club,go after the people who has done this to rangers and scottish football.it is starting to becoming a witch hunt again a club and it`s fans.i am starting to think that other fans are jealous of our success and wish to take down the big fish because this give them a better chance of winning something,"SAD".everyone is playing straight into celtic`s hands because they are the only real one who are going to profit from a weak or non rangers.THIS IS TO EVERY NON RANGERS FAN WHO COME TO THIS SITE,LETS MOVE ON, the club has been punished and if the SFA get there way the club continue to be punished,they don`t need other clubs help."HELL" mend any smaller clubs that have done any wrong doing because the "BAR" has been set high on this and smaller clubs won`t have big support or rich backers to save them.ALSO it will be interesting to see how many clubs in england that have done the same thing will be dealt with in the same way or will the be let off or given the time to pay unpaid tax.
"Your dead club hated everyone else in Scottish football...."- what are you going on about ffs- honestly?!? I did actually lol at the "well said mate" to follow- you just have to! That must have been the OP.....or his mum right?!?
@5 your right the spl/sfa shouldhave done more research into whyte, but dont you see who is running the sfa is it not ogilvy which he is a former director of the dead club? do you not think that he would just help yous out, was it not you fans who believed all the billionair stuff and was rubbing it in everyones face? ALL THE CORRUPTNESS NEEDS OUT! from the dead club to spl/sfa/refs, this needs to be a frsh start for Scotland.....i dont think you will understand anything because you thinking is that ppl/clubs want you gone just to ctah up with yous, this arrogence has to go or else you will never understand just what you club has done...because when a club is thought to have done wrong where only match fixing is worse deserve the harsh punishment, it is not a witch hunt, look at how many rules you broke and how much money you STOLE from ppl and all this money you could only win the league by a few points. just shows you how far behind you were to the other clubs because you should have won before kicking a ball. you had greed ppl in place yes and they killed you off, sounds to me like you are only blaming whyte why is that? DM who lisened to a porn person about how to run things did this to you with help of allyour legends including alyy and walter.....can you not admit they f*#ked you over because it hurst too much? or are you happy with all the trophies they bought? this show you just what most of you fans think and that is you welcome all the trophies and so the legends sould and club should not be punished but it should be the guy who put you in admin.....why do you think DM and walter left so they would be blamed for putting yous in admin....all your legends have jumped ship and still you cant believe or accept that they and your club are the wronf ones and it isJUSTICE that ppl want and not jealousy.....im thinking your jealous and mad that yous wont be in europe and winning trophies but hey you can always tone in and watch.
18 Jun 2012 17:08:44
Rangers to start next 3 years minus 25 points
I would rather start in div 3 ,at least we could play for a title,25 points would be disgusting as a punishment for one season,let alone three.Lets start at div 3,work our way back,and regain our dignity,and b****cks to the rest.
18 Jun 2012 17:05:28
Ok I for one would say that rangers need to go to the 3rd division and work our way up that is the right thing to do. Spl chairmen shouldn't be put in the position they are being put in by the sfa whether you like them or not. However.....
Do fans of all the other spl clubs really want to go through a season or 3 not visiting ibrox not having full grounds etc I would think not. Of course the hardcore fans of each Club with have the tinted speks on and say that we don't need rangers but they do. Just the same way as rangers need the other clubs.
We need the likes of Aberdeen and dundee utd for the rivallry likewise we need Celtic for the old firm these 3 games generate a tremendous atmosphere every time we play. With the rest of the teams as a fan who goes to most away games I love going to the different grounds yeah I would still have that in the 3rd division but it just wouldnt be the same.
U keep going on all the teams need u why is that i think u will find u need the other teams more for 1 sky have confirmed deal will still be the same 2nd poind if u r in 3rd u wont get enough punters in ibrox 2 cover costs fact
Sky said deal would be renegotiated
To poster 1. If rangers needed the other teams so badly wouldn't there be an outcry everytime someone got relegated clearly a punter with the tinted specks on as op said do you seriously think if anyone else other the Celtic was in this position there would be a vote for them to stay I think not so clearly the other teams need rangers and Celtic. Op well said
@3 it wasnt meant that rangers need every other team individually, more the teams in the SPL collectively,
to every1 who thinks that by going to the third division and rebuiling will make rangers a superpower in football get real, my opinion is the kids wont work in the third division,have u watched that level of football, they will be bullied. the senior players will be go and wages might not even be 1k per player per week max.
It will take a complete rebuild to climb the leagues and the manager and coaching staff will have to be flawless.
18 Jun 2012 17:04:53
So according to the SPL our history stands then if they want to punish us over history ?
Your history only stands for now because your still in admin for another 6-8 weeks, liquidation will officially commence after in which the oldco will be confirmed legally dead
18 Jun 2012 16:52:40
Thurs June 15:
Mr Clark of Duff and Phelps said, “As a result of that decision, which was known in advance of today’s meeting, the consortium led by Charles Green is obliged to buy the club’s business and assets and that transaction will be completed imminently."
Has Green handed over the money yet? Answer: Probably bloody not. He doesn't have any. He will only get some if fans buy season tickets. This guy is a chancer and shouldn't be trusted. Someone needs to ask the crooks, D&P, Green and Whyte, to show the transfer of real money to prove Green owns the club's assets right now, not 'imminently', that he isn't just 'obliged', that he has delivered. I don't believe legally he owns any assets. {Ed039's Note - £5.5m was deposited in an account in respect of Rangers plc so yes he has paid)
18 Jun 2012 13:44:02
so rangers need 7 votes in order to get back into the spl.this is how things stand with where clubs will vote.
vote for entry: kilmarnock,hibernian,st mirren,celtic
vote against:dundee united,aberdeen,mptherwell and hearts
undecided:inverness,ross county and st johnstone.
unless rangers can convince one of the teams who will vote against there fans wishes then even those who are currently undecided wont give them enough.
for the record i think motherwell can be reasoned with but not the others.thoughts ed?
Aye your counting is quality
St johnstone chairman mr brown says he wont allow newco in
Hibs and St mirren have also said they are not happy.
Hoopey67
Celtic and Hibs won't allow newco in either.
Motherwell is run by the fans and they don't want Rangers in.
They did their sums and Europe pays more than 2 visits by Rangers fans also bigger TV share and bigger prize money share.
The Metro states Motherwell are more on the fence than that. They see bad in voting yes and bad in voting no.
Celtic will surely vote yes. I think Hibs and Hearts will too.
18 Jun 2012 16:20:20
I see the spl have charged Rangers over the use of Ebts and a few of the possible sacntions are stripping of titles as well as points deductions and fines.
If that's the case then the all this no history rubbish ends here.
People can't have it both ways either Rangers face no more sanctions and are a new club or we take responsibility for what happened in the past and get fined or whatever.
Time the micky mouse spl and sfa made their minds up on this.
The titles are coming off the old club.
trfc has not got any titles to take.
If u dont no what u r talking about just dont post anything rangers r dead the new rangers r trying 2 take old membership for league transfer league shares it has nothing 2 do with your old history but if u want 2 keep history thats fair enough u will always be knowing for the team that got cought cheating not paying bills and had 2 shut down over it but anyway newco means new club i just dont understand what u dont get about that your own people have told u this as well get over it
Taking responsibility for the past ought to mean responsibility for all the debts. No debts = No history.
18 Jun 2012 16:16:48
At its meeting earlier today, the SPL Board considered a number of issues relating to Rangers FC.
EBT Investigation
The SPL Board heard a report from its solicitors following the investigation into payments to, or for the benefit of, players allegedly made by Rangers FC outside of contract.
The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC.
The investigation has now been completed and, in the view of the SPL, there is a prima facie case to answer in respect of its Rules.
Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13.
General Meeting
An application for registration of transfer of Rangers’ SPL share has been received. Consideration of the application will depend on receipt by the SPL Board of all required documentation and verification.
A general meeting of all 12 member clubs has been convened for 10am on Wednesday 4 July 2012 for members to decide whether to approve the transfer.
OP - on the face of it, not a surprise.
18 Jun 2012 15:26:15
The same SPL clubs who are currently going on about fairness and sporting integrity might be open to hurting themselves a bit out of spite against Rangers. However, the SFA have another thing coming if they expect this same fairness of approach to spread to a more equal share of revenues across the leagues and set the leagues up in a fairer way for the good of Scottish Football.
The only reason the SPL teams are considering the removal of Rangers from the SPL is because they hope the more even distribution of revenues will assist them in the long-term (so long as Rangers are not out of the league too long to reduce the Sky revenues greatly). I do not think that sharing that money across more clubs will come into their interpretation of fairness.
Maybe we should being out a system of Proportional Representation across the fans groups so every season ticket holders and regular ticket paying fan gets a vote, to fairly make the larger reconstruction and financial distribution decisions – Fair and Democratic. Oh sorry, that would not vote through the changes the 10 SPL clubs are looking for.
Any votes made by the SPL will always look after their clubs interests first and what is good for Scottish Football second … enough said !
GET OFF UR HIGH HORSE!! was your dead club think of Scottish football when or even Scotland's ppl and companys when you were cheating/stealing from anybody? you have no case to stand on and for you not to realize that is truley SAD just look at what your dead corrupt club has done to you and WAKE and look what it did to Scotalnd......and if clubs are looking to get more money they are just trying to recoupe what yous dead club STOLE from them.
18 Jun 2012 14:12:54
I've been trying to describe this situation to a friend in the USA, I finally made the analogy on the cold war under Reagan and several soviet leaders. The arms race of that era was ultimately won by the country with the most cash and, so it happens, a capitalist economy. The U.S.S.R could not ultimately compete, couldn't even afford troops stationed at its numerous borders and within its numerous satellite countries and disolved becoming simply Russia again. From an Old Firm point of view the "arms race" turned unequivocally in August 1998. 60,832, Celtic Park's capacity made all the difference. In league games alone approximately 1,805,000 more people have went through Celtic gates than Rangers during that time period till now. That is just the league, Euro's nights Rangers v Man.Utd, Celtic v Barcelona that 10,000 or so difference still applies. Conservative estimates would probably have Celtic having 3,000,000 more paying punters than Rangers in the past 14 years bringing in what? £60-£70m more? This more than anything arguably caused the reversal of fortunes we have seen in recent years. It was an arms race Rangers couldn't win, Murray probably knew this by around 2000, 2001. Only onfield success would counter it and then the porn star told him about EBT's, the rest we already know.
Gaz
Thats absolutely spot on and well put. Manchester United forced arsenal to build new stadium by increasing their capacity. It also left Liverpool floundering some 30,000 less. Its an insurmountable gap in finances. Many have watched rangers in bemusent in recent years and the 70m+ you mention has a familiar ring to it.the current shenanigans at rangers dont bode well for any change in attitude. In10 years celtic will have stretched that gap even further and it will be interesting to watch rangers. Ive never heard a rangers fan face up to this hard fact possibly because murrays smoke and mirrors act deflected their attention.
However, under new spread the wealth regulations planned by the SFA none of this will matter. We will have a far fairer distribution of wealth across all of the clubs so East Fife and alike will have the money to compete with the big boys. Viva Communism !
@1 The only way that the same figures will continue is if RFC plays in the SPL. Without the competition and after a run of league titles with little competition the only games filling the stadium will be early season, league title parties and euro nights. Hence the reason why CFC are actively trying to get out of Scottish football, they believe they are too big for it and need a bigger league for competition and revenue.
That is an excellent point m8..... never heard that before and it makes perfect sense. probs one of the best points ive read one here.
I disagree..the turning point was:
£12m Flo
£6.5m Ball
£5.5m Kanchelskis
£4.3m Konterman
£4m Hendry
Plus the countless crap we bought for £1-£2m in the early 2000's,
Trying to compete in Europe broke us, not trying to compete with Celtic. SG
"only onfield success could counter it"
we had just won 9 in a row! Europe was the challenge.
"it was an arms race Rangers couldn't win"
Yes, an arms race with Man Utd, Bayern Munich etc...that we couldn't win. Not a race with Celtic!
This is the worst argument I have ever heard.
And then theres attendance v capacity...average say 53,000 at parkhead, and 46,000 at ibrox? Not such a big difference.
And what about the extra corporate boxes at Ibrox, and the extra champions league money over the period?
Please prove me wrong but I doubt Celtic have had an income of £60-£70m more than Rangers over the past 14 years. SG
@3. That remains to be seen. The point is the gap is there no matter where rangers are. If your argument is correct rangers crowds will fall even further over the same period. The mathematical dynamic of the league will change. There will be more compétition than you might think. I cant see any way rangers can close the gap without a sugar daddy. Mr. King Seems to agree with that, but the south african govt. have cast a shadow over him.
Lol to our pinko comrade number 2.) I'm all for a fairer distributuion of league money but I draw the line at clubs sharing their gates short or in cup games but a good try my Marxist friend :)
Gaz
Gaz to 5) I've always said that was the season that things changed on the park and to a lesser extent off it too. Celtic spent a net £13.5m that season, Rangers spent a net £26.7m difference was the next year we shelled out another £6m for Hartson, Rangers became net sellers to the tune of £10m. Plus Rangers were already out of the Champions League when they signed Flo, you don't spend £12m on one guy then net reduce the value of the squad by £10m the next season when harbouring ambitions for European trophies. Flo was a big time fan appeasement after the 6-2 game and funnily enough became the Scottish transfer record after Sutton by the ratio of 2-1, or a tenner to a fiver, in that respect Murray was consistent if not a tad foolish. The difference and where my original post is to some extent validated, Celtic could afford this, the Gers drop off by £10m 2001-2002 suggests they couldn't. Today STV mentioned EBT's going back to 1998, same year Celtic Park was completed. Murray chucked money he didn't have at a problem that wasn't going away and had precious little to do with Europe.
SG your first post wasn't bad with one slight flaw (regards Ball and Kanchelskis, they spent one season together, hardly putting a team together for Europe then is it?) But I'll gladly explain away your other claims. Since 98 both teams have won 7 titles each, similar domestic cup success too within reason, plus not much cash from either anyway, so domestic success revenue, fairly even I'd imagine. Europe (your big ace in the hole I'm presuming?) Both been to a UEFA final, Celtic 6 Champions League appearances, Rangers 8, Celtic 2 Europa League appearances, Rangers 0. Both have had 8 "league" appearances in Europe but sure I'll give Rangers more Euro income overall during those 14 years. Arms race - after one big splurge on Flo, you weren't near the races again regards Europe's real giants, next season as I mentioned earlier, a net £10m selling club, hardly keeping up with the Man U's and Bayern's there are we? And I'm glad you mentioned capacity, as you say 53,000 to 46,000 thats over 19 games SG it was as you rightly say AN AVERAGE, so in league games alone 133,000 more at Celtic Park for that season with those two averages, thanks for making my point for me there. 2001-2002 the difference was 12,000 by the way. Rangers have won it once in 14 years - the Mowbray year! I don't know about exact figures, cant imagine corporate side sees a huge difference in either hence the reason so many companies buy boxes at both grounds for visitors etc. So to some up, over those 14 years, you haven't been even remotely near to being a big hitter in Europe spending wise, we tie roughly domestically on prizes and income, I'll give Rangers the slight nod in Euro income, corporate there will be washers in it either way. Still leaves the yawning gap of that 1.8m extra league fans doesn't it? And the extra 10k or so in European games. Incidentally Europe this season, Rangers gates at home 61,051, Celtic 150,350. Thats a good £2m difference right there yes?
Gaz
18 Jun 2012 13:32:58
where to start if we are not in league there will be a few other teams that wont have any games in the season firstly the glorious sheep 4 games a season against us st mirren under the leadership of his wee celtic namesake lennon and team of ex celtic players season over dundee utd for there total hatred of us re goodwillie even big duncan ferguson hate hate hate hibs say no more and finally celtic grew up in coatbridge there feelings towards us you would never believe so on and on and on i could go can't see us getting votes needed with all the chairmen saying about fans views taking into consideration what a lot of s#it we are hated from the wee boy at pittodrie spitting on us as he walks by with his mum to the chairman at the top and before all the fans of other teams come on and say this type of post is the reason we are hated,arrogant or whatever other name you care to call us we all know the truth and so do the rest of you the real truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth
Wow hold the press fans from teams in the same league dont like each other, i never knew
M GOODWILLIE.and how would thta have worked since you didnt pay anyone?? god that just be great but him for nothing and then sell on for few million no wonder no one give s a ?? what happens to you if you think thats ok
What was that all about ? Spewing out unwarranted hatred in an inept attempt at accusing others of unwarranted hatred.
Is this post the longest sentence in the English language?
I dont think yous could admit the truth if it was right in front of yous
18 Jun 2012 13:29:32
Is anyone else really sick of readin the you have no history, we do have history, you have no titles we do have titles argument?
The rangers who play next year have no history other than a few days.The rangers involved in a liquidation process will always have their history.Just like Renton and Third Lanark,defunct teams,but history(assuming no title stripping for EBT) intact...........green jhedi
There's nothing to argue over, you are a new club therefore you have no history and no trophies
Has'nt charles green bought ibrox,murray park,car park, and the rangers brand from oldco jhedi what do you think the rangers brand is? to me the colours,badge and history. dont forget oldco not quite liquidated yet takes time...mark.
The club is the same as it allways was. It#s the Holding company formed in 1899 that's getting liquidated. If we're a totally new club why we getting punished for what the old club did ?
So when you get your tittles stripped your club will make history yet again...by being the first newco to have tittles stripped off them that they dont even own, so you will be starting -8 in the whole being the most unsuccessfull club in the world.
and ok you say you have your history and your the same club, so im guessing you wouldbe fine by being punished for all you have done right? and that you will take/accept the penalties then,i highly doubt it, so what is it? feel sorry for just how messed up your are bye your dead club and all your legends that made you this way and yet you still love them and defend them.
So if this new rangers of a couple of days old has no history how can the spl charge this new club of dual contracts, and punish them, i,m afraid green jhedi you cant have your cake and eat it. or do all of you want to punish anything with the name rangers
@3;Your correct except one point,you cannot buy a history,The badge? i dont know but i dont think you can start up a newco thats trading too close to the style of the liquidated company. @6; They can charge them if they take the share of the oldco,I think the punishments for the dual contracts may be removal of trophies from the old rangers history.........green jhedi
The newco are taking over rangers share in the SPL just like anyone could if the SFA accepted them. The sanctions and punishments will be leveled at the Rangers share not the newco. If you don't want the punishments apply to the SFL for membership and work your way up otherwise take the punishments that go along with the share and entry into the SPL. Rangers are dead and so is their history that's a FACT.
It's appropriate talk of stripping "tittles" from a bunch of diddies. :-)
One last time for the hard of thinking (jhedi): football clubs are no liquidated, companies are. The 1899 company shall cease to exist shortly, RFC 1873 (for all the good and bad that goes along with) shall be contained within the 2012 company. The next title shall be Rangers' 55th (whenever I've written this before it has bin an attempt at irony, but on this occasion it is actually the case)- FACT. :-)
@7; jehdi with all respect leeds did mate and if double contracts where about then we should be punished. but what about the celtic player on a ebt i know it was paid off to hmrc but it could'nt have been in his contract to the spl/sfa...mark.
18 Jun 2012 13:54:36
i would urge all my fellow rangers supporters to get behind charles green. stop all this sir walter carry on. if watty and his consortium really had rangers best interests at heart they would have rescued our club long before now. Mr green is the only man in town so PLEASE give him your full support!
Is that you Mr Green?
Just askin like. :)
18 Jun 2012 13:10:29
Sky sports have stated they will not pull out of scottish football if rangers are in the 3rd division sourse sky sports and daily record
And another myth bites the dust...........green jhedi
Yes but sky obviously will be looking to renegotiate the deal, and the daily record jeez oh .
What 80 million over three years deal, big whoop
@1 aha ha ha ha you're now believing the DR! what face you wearing the day?
Sky Sports have said they will not pull out of scottish football if RFC is only out of spl for one season.
They have still to sign the new £80m contract which is still on the table and if RFC is out of SPL for more than one season they renegotiate the deal so as to pay less for less competition. Source Sky Sports.
Basically the new deal will be a much lesser deal and those clubs who have 30% of their revenue from sky will be hit and have to review long term conracts with some players.
@4; Listen you berk! i never swallow the tabloid tales,but check the Sly sports customer service.It was posted on there days ago.............green jhedi
18 Jun 2012 13:02:06
Ok so we have problems in the SFA, rangers have made fools of themselves no one else. The worry about no bumper money deals from tv. This is the chance for the SFA to step forward and totally revamp out leagues. Less leagues to me for a start, we need 3 maximum. More teams in each league. The highland leagues need to be taken into account. Our winters are terrible, no one really likes going to games in the freezing cold, the pitches are ruined and the gates are down. So we should have a summer league. Fill the gap that sky and espn have when they have no football to air. Am sure they would be happy to have football every week of the year. Crowds would be high every week, I personally love going to the football when its roasting hot. We need to create a product that sells. It would help our teams in the early stages of europe as our teams would be match fit, which is where our teams seem to fall apart atm. Any thoughts?
Don
18 Jun 2012 12:59:13
I know it's been covered at noisome on this forum that Rangers would not be allowed into English football by Uefa but can someone answer why if that's the case were Gretna allowed to switch between playing in England and Scotland, and from being a member of the Enlgish FA to being a member of the Scottish FA?
Gretna played in the Enlgish leagues under f.a. control from 1947-2002 and got as far as the northern premier league which is the league below the Conference. They have also featured in both the English and Scottish cups in a relatively short space of time..
In 1993 Grtena played Bolton Wonders in the English f.a. cup in a live tv game, in 2006 they were runners up Hearts in the Scottish cup and represented Scotland in Europe the next season. They have also played in numerous other cups on both sides of the border under the fa/sfa control.
If Uefa do have rules on clubs playing in other countries then it is obviously not set in stone as Gretna proved, Rangers should at least try would be better for the club to get out of Scottish football.
However, other Scottish/English clubs were not reliant on the revenue's Gretna provided. Moreover, UEFA and FIFA want to prevent the movement of teams from smaller leagues to bigger ones. It is a threat to the money chain that surrounds the two organisations and will never let it happen. Also the bigger leagues are not interested in bigger teams from smaller countries because it also create a threat to their Champions League spots, etc. All this talk on moving leagues is a non-starter. The money men in UEFA/FIFA will not let it happen, nor will the larger leagues (Spain, England, Italy, German and France) who benefit most from the status quo want it to happen.
Did all that not take place before the last UEFA directive?.........green jhedi
Given half a chance Rangers would have been off to England years ago waving 2 fingers to the rest of the SPL.
Now the entire future of the club is dependent on the goodwill of the rest of the SPL.
If you were a supporter of a smaller club whose support is depleted by locals travelling to Ibrox /Parkhead would you not consider this is a once in a lifetime opportunity to get even?
18 Jun 2012 12:46:54
season ticket renewal?
how can a credit agreement if you pay for the season ticket in 4 instalments with a company no longer exists can now transferred, surly each season ticket renewal should first ask do you want to renew?
not just accepted
18 Jun 2012 11:59:52
Can we rely on D&P to cast a vote
in our favour in 14 days time when
SPL vote takes place ? I mean they've
shafted us at every other turn.
That would be a no.... they never handed in the accounts ..etc there is a suprise so Rangers have no rightsinthat respect either,good old Duff &pHELPS USELESS TO THE END.OR WERE THEY??MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
How can they have a vote at all! Who are they representing? Rangers are no more - will Newco get a vote? Seems they would be just as entitled as the team formerly known as Rangers!
Rangers plc are still in existence just because they have been liquidated , this doesn't end the company this only happens upon dissolution of the company . {Ed039's Note - Dissolution will be the outcome of liquidation in 6-8 weeks)
Currently the old rangers 1899 don't qualify for an SPL license on two counts at least and therefore no SPL vote: 1. Failure to submit accounts after two generous extensions.
2. No team or stadium to play football.
If oldco under D&P have a vote on 4th July there's corruption going on.
Then why stv saying duff and duffer got a vote then? so i think i will listen to them sorry...mark.
18 Jun 2012 11:55:03
Do the 12 angry men get a stay of execution
Is there any integrity left in Scotland / Scottish football
We'll see eh?
Mo
Yes lets all show sporting integrity, Aberdeen will have their belated relegation, Dundee will refuse to go into the SPL because of the threat of administration for a third time and oh yes Neil Lennon will congratulate referees whatever the result!
Dream on!
Lennon again.You just cant help it some of you............green jhedi
He did mention Aberdeen and Dundee too Jhed.
Lennon was a sarcastic example of Sporting Integrity in scottish football, or do you always get your knickers in atwist when A gers fan mentions Lennon in a derogatory way? I think the amount of celtic fans on this "Rangers" site kinda mutes your point about a rangers fan mentioning Neil "Its the Refs fault" Lennon eh?
@3; Mutes your point? Sarcastic or not,Why bring Lennons name into it? Plain stupid...........green jhedi
Everyone should be allowed to post on here. It is part of our countrys history now and will be spoke about for years to come. It makes me laugh so much to see the amount of 'supporters' of this team that hasn't even kicked a ball in anger. No league status, no matches played, not sure where they are going.....
Four men had a dream, to start a football team, they had no money no strips not even a ball....
Kind of came full circle then.....
NO TO NEWCO
MIND THE GAP
18 Jun 2012 11:34:28
If we boycott season tickets whats to say green will actually sell to walter? If we force him out what makes us think he wont destroy our club, he has total control of our destiny for a meagre 5.5 million. Thats not very much to recoup when sitting with assets like he is. We think no one would want ibrox as it is listed and not in the best location for redevelopment, well what if green thinks outside the box and offers partick thistle a ground swap. They get ibrox and we get firhill. Partick is a better area than govan for development with its proximity to the west end im pretty sure he could make a few million back from that kind of scheme, he still then has auchenhowie and the albion to play with to try and then turn a profit. If we force his hand do we really know what green would do, all along he has said this is a buisness deal an investment. Well he has just purchased all our assets for buttons seems like good buisness to me.
Green has the assets, whose value is debatable but he does NOT have the money to fund the team going forward.
If you do not buy season tickets and the players refuse to join Newco under Green, then Green and the chancers with him, will have no choice but to sell out to Walter's group and be happy with whatever profit they make. That was always their intention but they won't make as much as they hoped.
SUPPORT WALTER! GET RID OFF THESE CHANCERS!
Thistle don't play in Partick but in Maryhill.
Thistle could never maintain ibrox.I do agree with you to a certain extent re; Green.I would be very wary of pi55ing this guy off,he seems a bit of a loose cannon.This silly support walter march might be a bad move,but on the other hand it might work.Is it worth the gamble?.......green jhedi
Im just saying that if i was green i wouldnt bow to boycotting and handing over the much needed assets for a small profit. I would flog the assets individually to recoup the money paid out and try to turn a small profit for them rather than bow to pressure from fans. Leave them with no tangible assets to build a newco from, basically leaving walter n co the rangers brand with no stadium or training facility just the fans. He has control of the assets not the club in my opinion whether we back him or not makes no difference to him because he will always make back the sum he has paid for us, if he somehow manages to flog players inbetween times he will make even more but that is unlikely at this point. The money he has paid to buy our club is peanuts in the football world, we would have wanted more for naismith alone for crying out loud. The guy has picked up a bargain whatever way you look at it. I smell an asset stripper.
You are of course assuming that Green would sell to 'football people'.As someone said, he might be a bit of a loose cannon. Lots of flats with a lovely frontage could be built on that ground.
18 Jun 2012 11:26:14
Met a chick from my old school the other day... History tells me she was a cracker and we all idolised her.... Not now at 20 stones!!
History... can be overrated
Similar to your analogy then.
18 Jun 2012 11:24:07
HISTORY -
Egypt - centre of world civilisation - modern calamity
Greece - Olympian leaders - economic basklet care
Rome - world rulers and EURO financial catastophe.
Rangers - 54 and now in disarray.
However. it is not what we did then it is whathappens in the dark days and the aftermath that will define us.
Germany - world pariahs and now economic leaders.
Japan - torturers and now innovators
Rangers - The future will define us as much as the past. We should look forward. and use our memories to guide us. I care not for gloating over 54... but looking towards the ressurection ( im not religious and i do acknowledge the religious connotation))
but to coin another phrase from a scots anthem... we can still rise now. (dont particularly care for rest of words.-- to anti english for me)... but we can rise, ressurect, be a phoenix.... whatever analagy you choose but the reason we wil still have tens of thousands is because of the loyalty and the history - the good and the bad. The banner said it all...
"if they make you play on the streets...we will support you from the pavements"...and I will will buy my season ticket wherever or whenevre .. with walter or green.... There is simply no other option... but the history debate....lets give it a rest
Do you sing - God Save the Queen , (Lets crush those rebellious Scots)
Is there an anti Scottish theme to "God save the Queen"? News to me if there is, it should be removed though if true. CheltBlue
@2;You really did not know about the anti scottish parts of your national anthem? You ever sing it? you know how many verses there are? Pathetic.........green jhedi {Ed001's Note - I didn't know about them before editing this site, but then I would never sing it.}
@3 Tell the truth green gunge, the verse was included because the song was written around the time of the Jacobite Rising 1745.
Marshall Wade was sent forth to quell the Rising which happened at Culloden. To say that the Jacobites represented all Scotland is complete and utter nonsense. But of course that doesn't suit your hidden agenda you berk!!
The words are 'rebellious Scots to crush' but of course that doesn't fit nicely with your point of view so you put a different slant on it.
The verse refers to the rebels being defeated and this occaision the rebels were the Scottish clans who supported Bonnie Prince Charlie. The rest of Scotland didn't and supported the Crown.
This is why the verse ends with God save the King. It is outdated but still remains in the anthemn. {Ed001's Note - there were more Scots fighting for the Crown, than there were for Bonnie Prince Charlie.}
18 Jun 2012 10:52:33
Only in Scotland could this fiasco still be dragging on! It's not fair on all the other clubs, how can they plan their pre-season, signings etc when no-one knows whats happening. Get the chairmen together and vote, never mind waiting till July just get it done so Scottish football can move on!!
Dmrangers
The other SPL chairmen are just business men the same as green. They want to see how much they will lose if rangers drop a division or two, just the same as the sfa big wigs they want to first find out how it will impact on their wage packet first, before deciding anything. It's a sad reflection on society, but it's always been the same money talks.
18 Jun 2012 10:51:36
I think the hatred that is going around towards Rangers is scary, its not just people saying you done wrong now make up for it, take your punishment and never do it again. Same thing that happens in all the courts in the land. We didnt pay tax and we cheated the system. We didnt murder anyone we didnt kidnap anyone but the pure hatred towards the club you would think they did.
One minute their being attacked as a club, the next their being attack as a business. The fans are being brought down, then the staff, and the board (who are to blame). In business this happens all the time, in football never, or we are the first, maybe there might be more. I dont however see that their fans will receive the same abuse as rangers fans have. Maybe think before you speak about Rangers as a whole.
Don
Good post Don.
However is anyone under the illusion that our enemies and those chuckling at our demise are only doing so because of the financial situation that has beset us?
Our problems are nothing more than a smokescreen which has unfortunately given them a platform to vent their feelings and show their contempt in public. Let's not be fooled by these people.
They abhore who we are,what we are,and the fact that we are still here.
P.O.B.
It could be hatred, it could also be just simply a desire to see justice and consistency, dare I say it fair play. There's a lot of teams where that could be explained, Airdrie thinking well David Murray put the final nail in our coffin. It could be Vienna thinking hmmm they want cash IN for Jelavic but wont pay the cash OUT for him. It could be any club who lost to Rangers while they were potentially fielding ineligible players for the better part of seven seasons. What you did do in each of those games was potentially deprive opposing players of win bonuses, progress through a tournament, silverware. To the clubs, deprived them of progress, silverware, financial security and in some cases money you owed them. To fans, you deprived them of a win over the "mighty Rangers", the chance of seeing their club remain in the SPL, be in the top six of the SPL, qualify for Europe. Abroad, you knocked out numerous teams through the very same actions and player ineligibility. Your actions impacted a lot of clubs, thousands of players and possibly millions of fans. But still the hatred is "scary". Marseilles actions were only proved to be domestic but like Rangers fans I agree it was clearly beneficial to their European progress that season. You have went on about it ad nauseum. Take a step from your blue shades for one moment and factor that in multiplied by perhaps EIGHTY clubs during the years of Rangers alleged financial doping...ahhhh, get the picture now? Replace "scary" with "understandable" whenever the penny drops.
There's no smoke without fire. Why are Rangers hated so much? It's likely been the arrogance that's surrounded the success and all that WATP stuff that winds people up. The conspiracy theories that Rangers can always get things their own way, including the refs. For many in the game it's like the chance to topple Gadaffi. Or to vote out an unpopular government that's lost touch with the people (Tories 1997).
On the other hand, it's only football.
18 Jun 2012 10:47:13
Simple solution to a problem.....
Pay off ALL your historic debt, you get to keep the titles and all that went with it.
Continue as a NewCo, then you are just that a NewCo, no debt, no history.
When I talk about debt, I am talking about the HRMC, Ticketus.
You should be looking to pay off your footballing debts before you are allowed to sign anyone else, all other people owed money should come to an agreement with the RFF over how much they could reclaim form that, after all was that the reason they set up this fund??
It doesn't matter what division you will be playing in next year but you should be making an effort to pay the smaller firms what you owe.... it is the right thing to do!
Agreed. Good and bad history must be contingent on each other.
Utter nonsense if you ask me
Yes I want us to pay or debts to all but we simple have not got anyone willing to do that if I personally had a couple of hundred million lying about I would pay it all 100% but I don't so I just have to support the team in future whatever they look like as a team
Whatever punishments we get I won't be enough but that's life I'm afraid
I'm about to be made redundant through a lack of investment at my work but that's life I'll get over it as should everyone else and just let rangers get on with it
18 Jun 2012 10:15:40
I feel there is a growing feeling amoung fans of other clubs and some commentators that there is now a danger of TRFC not being granted a licence to play in Scotland at all . This is due mainly to the lack of contrition and the possibillty of TRFC entering Scottish football DEBT free and begin to spend millions on players . I have been checking other clubs websites. The anger at the possiblity of a newco "swanning into the SPL" will result in Scottish football dying.
The whole oldco/TRFC business has now entered the realms of French farce . Does anybody connected with this mess have any shame at all ?
It doesn't matter what the fans and commentators feel, there is a possibility of not being granted a licence because,
1)no registered players so no guarantee that a season's worth of fixtures can be fulfilled
2)no league to play in as yet so a licence cannot be granted.
Al
18 Jun 2012 10:13:25
Does anyone else think it strange
now that the SPL fixture list is out
that Club 12 and Celtic don't play at
home on the same Saturday
They never play at home on the same day !
Think that was the point the OP was making mate.lol
P.O.B.
Well they have obviously done that just incase rangers are voted back in.
18 Jun 2012 09:55:22
BREAKNG NEWS.....
Greece to liquidate its economy and reform as The Greece with new pro-Euro party.
Well no history for them then lol...mark.
18 Jun 2012 09:35:36
I don't understand why SFA has the ability to enforce a new legislation on rangers given that the new rule has not even been voted on. Surely any new rule must start from now, rangers were liquidated before the rule was in place!
18 Jun 2012 09:26:12
With the SPL clubs yet to vote on whether to admit "newco" Rangers" to the top tier, "Club 12" appears in the fixtures - they are away to Kilmarnock.
Scottish Cup winners Hearts take on St Johnstone at Tynecastle, newly promoted Ross County welcome Motherwell and Inverness CT travel to St Mirren.
Dundee United host Hibs on 5 August.
With Rangers' SPL future uncertain, there is no Old Firm New Year's fixture. Instead, Celtic will play Motherwell on Wednesday 2 January.
After that round of midweek matches there is a break in the SPL until Saturday 19 January.
In a statement issued on Sunday, Rangers stated: "The governing body is sticking to the schedule of announcing the matches as planned but have taken the Ibrox men out of the list after the developments of last week, which saw Rangers FC change ownership under a newco scenario.
"The Sevco consortium headed by Charles Green completed the purchase of the club and its assets last week when HMRC refused to support an exit from administration through CVA.
"They are now seeking to transfer the SPL share from the old company - Rangers Football Club plc - to the new company
18 Jun 2012 09:07:57
do you think Celtic will be able to handle this new team that now exists?
or do you think they will fail as they did with the last team that played in blue and white?
Why dont u concentrate on ur own teams SHOCKING state! U's will be playing in division 3 anyway mate!
I think Celtic won the league by 18 points did they not? Now what colours did that defunct team play in again?..............green jhedi
Rangers are liquidated. Thats failure mate. Winning the league is success. You remind of father dougal on father ted that time... near....far away. Except with you its success-celtic......failure-rangers.
You mean that team thats dead that had to spend until it died just to beat Celtic by a couple points? that club? your lucky liq came because it was just going to by a run over for the following years to come. after spending soooo much just to beat us by 1-3 points was it worth it to lose your club and history? shows you just how good Celtic is and just how far behind yous were.
By the way now that our team does not exsist according to you lot why are you still here spewing your venom.Is it because its all you have ever been used to all your lifes that even now we are gone your words you just cant let go and except it the club you hated are dead.If this is the case go and find your new closest rivals to start spewing your venom at.Oh no silly me deep down you know we are still the same even though you try and say other wise so you will continue to come on here and spew your venom now that really is sad but what more could we expect.
18 Jun 2012 08:58:37
cant understand ppl still saying rangers havent been punished enough our club has been liquadated ffs,get a life and concentrate on scottish football trying to restore its credibility that has been going down the pan for years even before the rangers mess
18 Jun 2012 08:46:39
A football club dies when it goes out of existence and does not play another game at it's home ground ever again ie. Third Lanark.
It does not die due to what uefa class as corporate restructuring.
Rangers are still banned from signing players by the sfa cause its the same club. Rangers have also not applied for a new licence from the spl/sfa only the transfer of it's licence to a new corporate body.
A few weeks back when Rangers plc went to court to overturn the ban on signing players they were referred to as the company that presently owns Rangers Football Club not the club itself, The words of lord Glennie but what does he know?
And your point is what? Rambling nonsense.........green jhedi
18 Jun 2012 01:23:54
we told you from the start to take your head out of the sand that liquidation was going to happen but still you said we were wrong, if you take back any of the old con men then you will be in trouble again so we say bring on sir watty and join sir david and sir craig and all the rest of the knights........b {Ed001's Note - but liquidation was never certain. So you didn't know in advance or have any idea, you just gloated about the worst case scenario. Unfortunately, for Rangers, the businessmen didn't have the balls to match their mouths and refused to put the money up. But they could have done so at any time.}
Agree with Ed ! Given their hatred for everything Rangers and their absolute paranoia over the years, it amazes me that Celtic supporters would expect any of us to believe a word they said. That's what happens when you cry wolf
Ed, of course the OP didn't know in advance but from what we have discovered since it would have taken a massive investment in the club to get the CVA passed and given that no savvy businessman is going to fork out £30m plus just to clear debts then liquidation did have a sort of inevitability to it. In some cases I'm sure it was no more than gloating or wish fulfilment but the numbers clearly never came close to matching up and so worst case scenario was more accurately likeliest case scenario. {Ed001's Note - no, I am sorry, there was never any inevitability about it, the RFFF didn't raise enough, the so called Rangers men, like Walter Smith, were not interested in saving the club, just in a chance to make money afterwards. The problem was greed is more important to anyone involved than the club was. Any of the consortiums floating about could have got together and produced more than enough to get a CVA passed, but then they would have watered down their investment and not got a return for it. This could have been fixed easily if D&P had acted swiftly to bring in cash for the creditors, instead they fannied about with no action taking place until it was too late. But nothing was inevitable. None of it. Portsmouth have been in a far worse state, as have Bradford. Both were rescued. Though Portsmouth has sunk again, due to mismanagement since. To my mind, the major question that needs answering is 'what the hell where D&P playing at?' They never once acted in the interests of creditors. They never made the mass redundancies seen at Leeds. They did nothing to help the situation at all.}
2) again here Ed, while I agree there have been many puzzling decisions by D&P throughout, Rangers previously poor share issue attempts suggest RFFF cash was at best going cover the ocassional debt or bill. Big hitters were seriously never coming in till post liquidation I fear. I agree a lot of selfishness in there and Smith's timing was diabolical but given that HMRC seemed set on taking a stand here I find it unlikely a CVA was ever going to be accepted. Out of interest what figure do you think they would have accepted, start point was what £55m debt? {Ed001's Note - they would have accepted a decent figure, probably somewhere around 20p in the pound or higher.}
2) Again Ed, a CVA of £11m post expenses, D&P costs. Plus the big tax case presumably diluting that further, honestly I just don't see when it was ever viable.
18 Jun 2012 00:46:40
you all want to keep your history, one bit of history that will stick to rangers old or new is that they are the biggest con merchants under the sun. and will always be known as a team who bought players and did not make payment,so well done your history makes good reading, now you;s are green & whyte.....b
As far as i am aware nobody has been found guilty of this yet, you are jumping the gun my dim friend. There is no doubt the ebt case could go against rangers for misuse of the system but on the other hand they could have used a legal loophole to their advantage!
Another bit that stays is the vitriol shown towards us by certain hate fulled sections of other clubs support. Well done yourself you walloper, do you feel better after your wee stab there?
Ah well something else we are bigger than you lot at lol.
If were honest , its a fair point.If Celtic had done it we would be saying exactly the same to them.
Sharkbait
Rangers 1899 - 2012 are a national disgrace. They should be forgotten quickly.
No right minded individual would wish to be linked to that tainted shame.
Our new Rangers should start in div3 and cleanly make our way back. Trying never to raise the issue of the oldco ever again.
We keeeep all our history, yes the embarassment of now and the embarassment of sectarian behaviour of a few. Ive take my boy since aged 6 and taught him that he can support the team without hate of others or sectarianism. My support will transfer. I revelled in the glory days but also watched celts 9 in a row as kid. I can deal with these dark days. Im a supporter...thats what we do.... but we go on. You celts are overfixated on 54. Im sorry but you are.
The poster is right. After all the dust has settled after all the drama has been resolved. Do u seriously think ANY fans in Scotland and beyond will just forgive and forget
Are u mad?
Be prepared for a tsunami of ridicule for yrs and yrs and yrs
Eds picked up on this a few times the corruption in italian football makes us look like pety thieves look at Juventus they were relegated for match fixing kept a few players what do people call them now mate? ....... Champions And that will be us in a few years so run along now wee man!
Larky Bear
Sticks and stones...#7
We'll do our talking on the pitch,just like we always did.
P.O.B.
17 Jun 2012 23:21:48
Here's a question I take it the investigation of duel contracts is for the oldco therefore if we are found guilty the SPL can't punish the newco as its not the same company?
You could be right,however it could strip the oldco of titles for its past misdemeanors(if found guilty)....does the newco have a history?if the oldco debt has been wiped out should the oldco history die with it?
Thats right mate,but the guilt is rangers old or new....b
Punishment of sorts will be reallocation of titles rendering some of the history argument redundant.
2. as would be the innocence but don't let that get in the way.
The way I see it is that if you apply to get the dead clubs sfa/spl share and are successful then there will be sanctions and penalties put in place for the newco (zombie) club regards to the ebt fiasco so the newco (zombie) club will Infact not escape scot free.
Briggs {Ed001's Note - no, the sanctions will be applied for allowing a new club straight into the SPL, rather than them having to start at the bottom and work their way up.}
3) re point 2, how can the guilt be rangers old or new if we don't have the history? We either keep the history or we don't. Ergo if we don't the guilt has gone away, you muppet.