Rangers Rumours Archive April 14 2012

14 Apr 2012 21:42:31
With all the talk about liquidation not happening because a cva offers better value to the creditors, is this not when the dodgy accounting and balancing of the books comes back to haunt you. Not quoting the exact figures but close enough....debt £135m. value of Ibrox- Murray park- the Albion etc (on paper for loan purposes etc) £120m. Add the playing staff and value must be very similar, therefore does it not make total sense for creditors to hold out for liquidation rather than accept 10p in the pound?
On the question of cva or liquidation would liquidation not allow the newco to own the rights to the catering, strips, club shops etc everything that was sold off under Murray?

Jd

I do believe it was reported a while back that Craig Whyte transferred these assets to another company...who knows though. Dont think liquidation will happen, but at least if it does, well be debt free, still in the SPL, and still get to keep our history/name/crest under SPL rules.

You can say what you like, you will not keep any history and you will be a new club. As for ibrox being worth 109 million, lol, and thats why it sold for �1

Some Rangers fans really embarrass me.
The club used to be worth being associated with the dafties, but now the club's fecked, I might as well just walk.

Players will no longer be Assets under liquidation, Contracts will be ended and all will leave for �0. Therefore not a good deal for the creditors. Ibrox, Murray Park, Albion Car Park are valued higher as they are part of Glasgow Rangers (who turnover between �50 and �60m) @ �70m. If Rangers are Liquadated then the value of these Assets decrease (See D&P Report) estimated at @ �20 to 30m as they become land investment assets with conditions ie planning restrictions etc. Secured Creditor is owed �30m and is paid first (guaranteed) therefore Unsecured creditors ie HMRC, Ticketus and all others would get a share of between @ -�10m to �0m. Not a good deal for Creditors. A CVA would see the unsecured Creditors get a share of whatever a potential buyer was willing to pay ie at �0.10p to the �1.00 @ �13.5m or �0.20p @ �27m. The new investor would then have to negotiate with CW for his shares. Unsecured creditors would get a share of all of this money. Now you tell me, What is the better deal for the Creditors? And before anyone says CW stated that he wants �30m, CW stated lots of things, he didn't allways do or get them. At the end of the day, the ball is in HMRC's Court, they must decide what is in the best interest of the tax payer of which I am one. Only a bitter and twisted mind would argue that an employer of many be closed down because of the actions of a few, especially in these times when every penny rec'd in tax is needed as so many on here have so often said. The People are lining up to save our club if possible, and the money being put forward should not be discarded so flippantly by those in our society who would cut off their noses to spite their faces. I for one would love to see all the money owed be paid in full but in reality this will never happen, the cash ain't there! But I would rather public services etc at least get something. TPTB have given any new buyer a way of transfering the Club as an Asset to a Newco in order to retain our history and the punishment for this is to be decided at the end of this month. I hope a CVA is acheived as this, I feel is the best deal for the creditors, however, transfering to a Newco may seem a better deal to potential investors. I guess they have to weigh up the cost of the transfer inc punishment against that of a CVA just as HMRC should with that of Liqiudation or a CVA. At least there are now a couple of viable options for the club to acheive an exit from this sorry mess. Rangers will never die, TPTB would never allow it. WATP.

Yes we will keep our history Declan

Craig Whyte is thought to have a floating charge over Ibrox,Murray Park and the Albion. This would mean he would get 100% of what he is owed from any sale of those assets via liquidation leaving less for the other creditors.

Anybody who wants to say that a newco is the same with the same history is just kidding themself on. The easist illustration oof why this is daft is to think of the five stars on the former Rangers jerseys. Do you seriously think EUFA would permit a newco to show stars upon the commencement of it's operations when said newco had never before competed in Europe nor is eligible to?!?!?!

Eh, no you won't! History is not an asset and as such cannot be bought or sold. The timeline will stop and start again with a newco

Celtic will deal with the morons who shame the club and it will be easier to deal with once newco is up and running somewhere. Rangers have a much bigger job to deal with, its built into the psyche. Would you agree that some of your history is not worth saving ?

Eh, ye it will! That is what this rule change is all about! Don't you get it! The business will transfer over 75% of its Assets to a Newco, this will include the club and ALL, leaving behind a small % which will be accountable for the debt. You can wander about with your hands over you eyes all you like protesting that the World is flat, meanwhile the rest of us will move on as the records will show in due time. Rangers will never die, TPTB would never allow it. WATP.

Yes you will keep your history ... as tax dodgers and thieves .That will never be forgotten no matter where you end up or end up as !....TTTS

You can say what you like, you will not keep any history and you will be a new club. As for ibrox being worth 109 million, lol, and thats why it sold for �1
--------------
Think you should have a wee read of the SPL rules, Ill say HAW at you

Not an expert on the rules but I think the SPL mean a newco will be allowed to keep its SPL history. The Cups and pre-SPL trophies are the preseve of other authority and no clear statement as to the removal/retention has been made to my knowledge.

The SPL wil "allow" you to keep you history. Well if that keeps you happy charge on. We all know this is the equivalent of putting lip stick on a pig. You can dress it up however you like, its still a pig and its still the end. It's history you'd be better shot of but if it keeps you happy then so be it.

If the creditors are being offered more under a CVA than a sale of assets, then they will accept the offer. There is nothing stopping the administrators from selling the most valuable players in May if a CVA can not be agreed.
They will then liquidate the remaining assets and pay the creditors proportionally.

The Public should demand a CVA! After all it is our money they are writing off if its not accepted.

Didn't the players insert clauses due to the reduction in pay. This could affect the price that would be acheived in any fire sale. Plus what club will pay top cash for any Rangers player under the circumstances?

I don't believe these clauses exist and I accept RFC will not get the full value for any players sold in a firesale. However the administrators will need a supply of funds in the close season if a CVA can not be agreed. Selling players is the only other source of income, a number of Portsmouth players were sold during the administration period. There is no guarantee that the BTC or Ticketus or CW's share ownership-asset floating charge will all be resolved before the end of the playing season. No debt consolidation = no CVA= administration in close season.

Lots of theories here.Let's try a few facts:
1-Ibrox valuation is replacement.Perfectly legal to quote it.However,more likely valuations are around �20-25m if stadium is sold for football reasons(Only 1 club would play there) so without RFC a redevelopment value would be around �15-20m.
2-HMRC have made it clear they will not agree a CVA.They oppose them as a matter of policy,especially if there is any proof of evasion,and HMRC treat EBTs as evasion.They won't take 10p in the pound.all this talk that anything is better than nothing is rubbish.HMRC will take nothing,as a deterrent to anyone trying to pull the same scam.
3-our SFA licence is running out.Without this we can't play in any league,never mind the SPL.If we go down the newco route,SFA rules state:
The share is NOT TRANSFERABLE from one legal entity to another.
Therefore,if we're liquidated,our SFA licence dies with us.
4-We're running out of cash rapidly,can't sell STs for next season(don't know where,or if we'll be playing),only a couple of home games to generate income.Fans efforts are great but unless someone can raise around �3m a month to pay costs,we'll be skint sooner rather than later.

That's without dealing with CW,SFA/SPL/Police enquiries,court cases etc.We may have to face the fact that there will be no RFC next season.Hope not,but it doesn't look good.

HMRC have made nothing clear, so your 2nd fact is just another theory. Agreeing to a CVA in no way endorses the use of EBT's and is not sending any weak signals to other companies.
As for the SFA licence, this will be resolved on April 30th when the SPL revisions are agreed.
If Rangers start to run out of cash in the close season then they can sell players to raise working capital, all perfectly legal.

The position is dire, no argument, but it is salvageable, liquidation also does not mean the end of the world if they can stay in the SPL, even with the agreed penalties.

It will take Rangers 4-5 years to recover from this fiasco whether it is a CVA or liquidation. The first 3 years will be very tough with no Europe and/or only 25% SPL money but it can be done.

Rangers fans will adjust to the new reality just as Celtic fans have done, when was the last time Celtic got through to the 10 million pound group stages of CL, I believe it was 2008.

14 Apr 2012 17:37:22
Terrible news about the Livrono player Morosini, all the best to his friends and family.

GovanFR

Totally agree. Whats happening with these young athletes. I wonder if these
energy drinks cause problems. jl

Horrible news mate. Just read on the SerieB website that the entrance that the ambulance was trying to enter was blocked by a traffic police car. Imagine how angry they're fans and his family must be. it apparently delayed its arrival on the scene until they smashed the traffic police cars window to move it. Heartbreaking. RIP Piermario Morosini

Also a mention for the poor horses who lost their lives in that lousy grand national.

Praying for GODS BLESSINGS for his family

This is happning far to much these days, r.i.p