Rangers Rumours Archive April 26 2012

 

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26 Apr 2012 23:15:01
STV online - Sandy Jardine threatening fan actions against other SPL clubs 'who haven't helped'.

Believable43 Unbelievable9

I really wish ex players would just shut up ..what is the point of idle threats ..grow up

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Bitter, twisted, show some remorse for the cheating Sandy! On and off the football field!

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Why should other clubs help? We wouldn't help them tbh

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Jardine is a moron inciting more threats. I thought ally's comments were dumb but jardine's are classic.

STOP BLAMING EVERYONE ELSE. It is your own damn fault.

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STV Online - Sandy Jardine threatening Rangers fans that he may play again.

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Ehhhh!
Bored tims on our page again??
Think the bottles should be tucked up in bed sucking their dummies!!!
Other clubs are like leaches around rangers when they come to town, let's see how they manage without the supporters, wonder who will by the Ł5 mars bars now! Mmmmm

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Sandy is complaining about the number of penalties being flung at them from all corners.

The penalties reflect the number of offences, what does he expect ?

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Any good will I might have had towards Rangers plight has well and truly gone.P*ss off and bully someone else

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I wish everyone would keep calm and stick to helping to save our club

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This shambles is spiralling out of control, too many people losing their heads.

His interview is embarassing.

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Fantastic more bully tactics and bad press. Honestly can this club steep any lower at the minute.

You know what ur right sandy this is the answer because it's everybody else's fault in Scottish football.

How dare they treat rangers like this ffs get a grip. If this was Celtic they would be getting the same pelters rangers are just now and u know it.

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Am a tim but this tit is makin a mockery o the good honest rangers men who only ave the club at heart

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I'm sorry I'm a loyal Bluenose but us saying we'll help ruin another club for one man actions is the same thing we're made at. So I can't really go alone with this. Lets just put more pressure on the individual(in a non violent manor please). Look at the post on the Rangers media site about Drysdale. They just expose another inept person and quwstions the SPL's judgement skills. JMO
WATP!

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McCoist, Walter Smith and Jardine are jokes. Noise. A minor distraction. Pity those who listen to them.

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Ok so the club Ambassador says:
 "the club should be treated differently because of the club’s stature and said that the outcome had implications for other clubs, including direct action taken by Rangers supporters groups"

Why dont they just rename the SPL to the SRL Scottish Ranger League?

“Rangers are a special case mainly because of the size of the club within Scottish football and what it delivers"

You could not make this up, worthy of being in Ranger Rumours as a Rumour... But its not... 
Seriously cutting your  nose off to spite your face really is not the way forward.  

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As a fellow bear, though I daresay I will be accused of being a closet Timmy but..lets face it, this is getting embarassing to us every passing day, we have turned into a complete laughing stock and not just in Scottish football circles. The episode today with Jardine and yesterday with the boss is really just adding fuel to the fire to those who will conspire against us. Boycott other SPL clubs blah blah, I have to say most other Timmys and fans of other clubs who post on here are right, it is our custodians of the club who have caused this mess, not the St Johnstone's, not the Dunfermline's and you know what it's not even the fault of those from the east. This is our doing and it makes no sense for us to continually blame anyone and everyone bar ourselves, this really is not helping our cause in any way that I can see.

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Where are they Ray Wilkins, Trevor Stevens, Mel Sterlands, Terry Hurlocks, Graham Roberts, Chris Woods; when are they coming out in defence of our club?

They all enjoyed the highlife in Glasgow when they were paid big money to come from south of the border.

Why is it left to Scottish based players, were are all the players who enjoyed the high-life, why haven't they spoke out in public in defence of our beloved club

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All this talk by ex players and managers aint helping our cause it will end up no one will care about us where is the positive spin its all negative sad ger here

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The football worlds eyes are on us just now we need positive press this aint doing us any favours for a potential bidder to many people losing the plot

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Every day it just gets lower and lower, I couldn't believe Ally's call 2 days ago. I mean from a 49 year old man too. We think of him as a rookie but this is about adult common sense and he's 49!
Jardine has just brought it to a new low....let's all punish the other SPL clubs. How smart is that when you need friends.
It's one honing thd club messing up and the fans saying it wasn't us, but if we're gonna do bad stuff to other clubs and undermine scottish football we can't play the victim anymore.

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Re - where are all the woods, roberts etc.. Yes they were paid good money etc. but they did the job they were signed for - to stop Celtic 10 in a row and then they equalled the 9 iar. Even though it appears there may be some legal "infringements" getting there. They came North for the money, not for the love of the club.

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Mccoist, hately, smith, jardine all seem hellbent on painting a target on peoples backs. this is a dangerous game to play and very irresponsible. they're making it sound like a war cry ffs

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I wish our clubs representatives, manager and fans would act with some dignity and then maybe, just maybe, we might be able to start restoring some credibility.

Big G.

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Just watched the Jardine nonsense again. He mentioned the name Craig Whyte 22 times and blamed him for everything and claimed Rangers was innocent of everything. Walter Smirh at the same nonsense saying the club was perfectly well run before Whyte and paid all it's bills.
Guess that's the agenda then.
Say it often enough and some mugs might believe it. Pair of liars.

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Im a Celtic fan and honestly feel sorry for the HONEST Rangers fans out there who have been put in this position but honestly if my club was in this position the last thing I would want is people like this opening their big mouths and bringing further embarressment to the HONEST and TRUE fans

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No player benefitted from EBT's, the sole beneficiary was RFC.
The only way RFC could meet the players nett wage demands, was to pay them gross, without any tax or NI deductions. {Ed001's Note - the player's were the ones who benefited, what kind of ridiculous statement is that to say they didn't??? Who was paying less tax as a result of them? Oh yes, that's right, the players were!}

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Quite simply, a boycott on away games. they say they dont need us, so lets boycott away games. We wont be liquidated. we will be out of admin soon. all will be well. but i think we should stick the boot into everyone else next season. we are rangers. no one likes us. we dont care!

Watp

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Perhaps the former players are not leaping to our defence because as recipients of EBTs they fear that HMRC will go after them next.

When you come to think about it they are the ones who didn't pay the tax, Rangers only facilitated the operation.

What I mean by this is that Rangers payed their agreed salary in full, it was because they didn't pay tax that the money was effectively like a higher salary!

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I am neither a tim nor a gers fan, and I certainly do not want to see RFC liquidated, but my sympathy is being eroded away by arrogant statements from certain quarters. It is terrible PR, and in some sense typifies the reasons Rangers are in this mess in the first place.

Anorak

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When is this dross going to stop, Jardine and mcCoist drip feeding hate and making a horrible situation worse. The fans who are responding and reacting to these 2 A/Hs are not Rangers supporters.they are vile individuals who are bringing shame on our club. Stop blaming everybody else for our plight the buck stops at our own door because of David Murray, Craig White ,Walter Smithand even McCoist (who only still is manager cause of the S''t we are in).
Rally the troops certainly but, do it with a bit of dignity. have passion without the bile. remember when the eastenders were having their problems we happily wound them up and McCoist was happy to gloat. So why are we acting like we are innocents not guilty of anything. Focus on the people who put us in this position dont let them send us down the wrong path . Been a ger for 50 years will always be a Ger but I wont promote hatred . We are better than that.
In Murray I trusted
In Whyte I trusted
In McCoist I trusted
I was a fool. WATP

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Yeah your right HMRC have a choice they could chase the employer, employees or contractors in most cases. However as players are generally employees of a club, and its easier to bring one body to task ie Rangers, rather than 30 or so players thats why they have gone down that road.

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Ed,

I never make ridiculous statements.

Its very simple, the players agent wants a certain wage, RFC cannot afford this wage but offer a lower wage tax free, in other words the player netts what he would have netted under a higher wage.
The agent doesn't care as long as the player netts the amount he would have netted under a taxed higher wage.

T Butcher wants 10k per week and netts 6k per week after deductions. Rangers offer him 6k per week with no deductions. T Butcher doen't make anything out of the deal but RFC save more than 4k per week. Obviously they will juggle things around a bit, but as long as T Butcher is clearing 6k per week then he doent care how they splice it or dice it.

Anorak. {Ed001's Note - you are still missing the point, no one would have paid 10k a week, or he would have just gone there instead of taking the deal with Rangers. So he is getting more money than he would elsewhere due to the use of the scheme. Hence he is the one benefiting, just as much as the club.}

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Ed,

You cannot state no one would have paid him 10k per week as an argument against the principle.
Lets assume he was on 10k per week at his old club and wont move to Rangers for less than 12k per week( 8k nett). Rangers can't afford 12k per week but offer him 8k per week nett, he still does not benefit but the club does.


Anorak. {Ed001's Note - he does benefit, he would get a big signing bonus, for starters. If there were no benefit to him, why the hell would he move? No player moves unless it is of benefit to them. What you are saying is just ludicrous mate.}

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I would like to think most if not all my posts in here have seen me come across as a rational non-bigoted Celtic fan but "ambassadors" and I use the term very lightly, like Jardine and McCoist (this week anyway) are doing the club no favours at all. Threats, open or hidden, unfair witchhunts on the SFA panel, does anyone in their right mind think these outbursts with help Rangers at the SPL vote next week? Doesn't either of them think these comments will make other clubs fans heap more pressure on their own boards to say to hell with them? You aren't the only club with a fan base who can exert pressure. A couple of thousand Aberdeen fans can have as much influence at Pittodrie as ten to fifteen thousands Gers will at Ibrox. Sure boards have to pay more than lip service to the economic impact of a poor or defunct Rangers but this week Jardine and McCoist have done nothing to engraciate Rangers to anyone outside their own fan base. It's times like this and comments like Jardine's (who, as ex Rangers players go, I always had a lot of time for) that find even rational Celtic fans like myself running very short on sympathy for the club. In the most part I temper this with thoughts of Rangers fans I know who will clearly be hurt by recent events but trust me if spokesmen like those two can cause offense to the saner non-Rangers supporting fans in Scotland think what they are doing to the rest?
Gaz

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Ed,

I am not suggestig a player does not benefit from a transfer, I am saying a player does not benefit from an EBT. A player gets signing on fees, pay increases without EBTs. {Ed001's Note - but he does benefit, as otherwise he would be paying tax on the money. You just aren't making any sense.}

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Ed,

I am far too old in the tooth for straw man arguments, no player benefitted from EBT's, the sole beneficiary was RFC, is not the same as no player benefits from a transfer. {Ed001's Note - whatever, if you can't see that a player benefits from EBTs, then there is just no point in trying to argue. I may as well shout at the wall, because you are completely missing the point. There is no straw man argument at all. I am not sure if you are dense or just one of those players or reps of a player and are trying to cover their deception with lies about them not gaining from the usage. Next you will be saying that players moving to Spain didn't benefit from the lower tax rate there.}

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Ed,

I object to ridiculous, ludicrous and dont make sense comments when they are unsupported. It has already been explained to you how the non payment of deductions does not benefit the player but the club, the player netts what he would have netted anyway had the club been able to afford his gross wage demands. {Ed001's Note - and you are still missing the point. The club would not have met his gross wage demands without them, so he wouldn't have got as much money as he was getting. Your comments still don't make sense. Both parties gained from the arrangement.}

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Ed,

I dont know if you are dense mate but tax free status in Spain is another straw man argument you wish to take me to.

Stick to the point, the player wants 12k per week and Rangers can not afford him, they pay him 8k tax free and he gets the same nett amount as if he ws paid 12k gross.

Its simple. {Ed001's Note - yes it is very simple. He is getting more money than he would otherwise. That is the point. You are clearly missing it. It is not difficult and exactly the same as the Spain tax rate issue. Perhaps you should just stop wasting my time.}

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Ed,

I suggest you stop wasting my time by claiming a player who gets 8k tax free instead of 12k gross-8k nett is getting more money.

I see you don't like to be proved wrong, get over it. {Ed001's Note - I am not being proven wrong. Prove to me that any one of those players could have got 12k gross elsewhere. I know you can't, because quite simply they couldn't. I am not wrong, I know I am right. I can remember asking a bunch of the players who moved their during the Souness era, why they joined Rangers. Every single one of them said the same thing: money. Rangers were offering double the wages they could get anywhere else.}

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The club would not have met his gross wage demands without them, so he wouldn't have got as much money as he was getting.
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Eh?

He would have gone to another club who could afford his wage demands, whats that got to do with it ?

As for Spain, a player earning 12k tax free does earn more than a player earning 12k in the UK, the problem is we are discussing a player earning 8k tax free and not 12k. Rangers could not afford the 12k, remember ? {Ed001's Note - he would have gone to another club who could afford his wage demands if there had been one to begin with. That is the point, they joined Rangers for more money. Again it is going right over your head. Remember when Mark Walters moved to Rangers? Why did he choose Rangers over the multiple other offers he had? Simple, they offered much higher wages.}

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Double the money anywhere else ED and that's why Rangers are at such a low point today. No one else is to blame, not the SFA, not Celtic, dare I say even Whyte but over-spending on players and other senior members of staff.

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It is a simple thing. A player wants 12K per week no-one wants to pay that. BUT along come Rangers who tell him we will give you 8K tax free which is the same as 12K gross. Rangers benefit by getting the player for 8K instead of 12K & the player gets the amount of money he wants. This is particularly attractive if no-one else is prepared to offer him 12K.

The player is only interested in how much money he gets in his pocket, and as a result of an EBT he 8K tax free is worth more than say 10K when full deductions are made!

Simples - Compare the tax doge.com {Ed001's Note - exactly, so both benefit, as I have been saying all along.}

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Just a wee question to the tax issues with players. Forgive me if im not getting or understanding it fully but. do you think the players that got ebt contracts knew about them and if so arent they also breaking the law by tax evasion. i.e if i was working on the side and the company knew i was but still paid me cash in hand arent both parties at fault? {Ed001's Note - if they know about it, then yes, both parties are at fault. But it is a big if, most players leave the details to their agents or reps to sort out.}

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Its not helping our cause when ex players and staff make stupid comments it makes us look bitter

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Rangers payed players through EBT's not to save money, but to pay the players higher wages than they could get elsewhere ?

Pointless exercise.

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This is particularly attractive if no-one else is prepared to offer him 12K
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Sigh...

So now you wish to redefine my statement to " players may benefit from EBT's if no one else is willing to pay the asking price " ??

If no one else was willing to pay the asking price then Rangers would base their EBT on the market price, not some unrealisticl wage demand. The whole point of the exercise is to save Rangers money, not throw it away on wages that nobody else would pay.

I give up. {Ed001's Note - you really don't get it do you? Rangers were attracting players by paying them over the odds, partially due to their use of the EBT scheme. The players got higher wages than they would elsewhere and the club got better players, so both got a benefit from them. What is it that you don't understand?}

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Ed,

You have no evidence nor reason to support your claim Rangers were paying players over the odds or wages they could not get elsewhere. Rangers could not afford the market rate for better players, and that is precisely why they payed them through EBTs. {Ed022's Note - You're right, we totally suck. Our bad.}

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26 apr 2012 23:11:59
breaking news tonight!!!
bring kennedy and the blue knights
join forces to take control of rangers and
take the fight on against the forces against rfc.......

Believable29 Unbelievable27

I wouldn't get too excitedon this one. They'll take a back seat again on Monday. We've been fed this one twice before.

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One thing that they have overlooked in all this. Craig Whyte is still the owner and will need at least Ł30 million to walk away. Now go back and dream up another story that is actually believable.

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Actually legally whyte shares can be removed because he Borrowed the money from ticketus, and he illegally bought the club using that money, so it can be legally removed.

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Is it not the case he bought the shares for Ł1 and then got ticketus to pay off the loan. He never used the ticketus money to buy the shares. He just used ticketus as part of his proposal. 

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In my opinion the stumbling block is not the BTC, it's Craig White. Like him or loathe him, he legally owns the shares.

He bought the shares from SDM for a Ł1. The key conditions of the sale was that he paid off LLoyds, and invested in the club. CW did pay off Llyods, the manner in which he did pay was dubious! However, he did not invest in the club. Therefore, he legally owns the shares.

It would take a strong legal challenge to remove the shares from him. this could take months/years, and be very costly.

The problem is that Craig Whites know this, and he can sit back whilst people try to talk around him, but eventually they have to talk to him.

Rangers cannot delay, they have to get his shares in order for the club to move forward.

Every day tht the potential buyers do not talk to him, makes CW stronger. He can sit bake take the media flak, but he will be the only person who makes money out of Rangers.

Only alternative not to talk to him is too liquidate.

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Even bigger issue -
If they stiff Ticketus (as reported).
a) Ticketus go after CW for the money.
b) CW goes after RFC for the money, to pay Ticketus.
The money was used to pay the bank so RFC benefitted from it.

CW still holds the shares and would more then likely be a wee bit upset!

Can't see how stiffing them works.

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If CW can be legally removed as someone claims, then why hasn't it already been done. I think you will find that D&P and all interested parties will have examined that closely. In the real world things are never quite as simple as you want them to be.

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CW will hand over his shares for a Ł1 to whoever takes over his 24-27 million liability to Ticketus. In liquidation CW's shares are worth zero once he repays Tiketus from his floating charge.

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There is no point in TBKs stiffing Ticketus, they will end up paying CW the balance for his shares.

Its simple, ratify the Ticketus deal( 27 million) and offer the creditors 11-12 million under a CVA, total cost of a debt free RFC with all its assets including players is approx 40 millon.

Its not the worst deal in the world, break even for 3-4 years due to Ticketus deal and penalties, and then they are clear of all debt....and penalties.

Too many bidders want to steal Rangers for next to nothing, instead of looking at it as a long term investment.

Anorak.

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Too many bidders want to steal Rangers for next to nothing, instead of looking at it as a long term investment.


Correct I would say that for the bid to be more attractive than liquidation they would need to bid around Ł60 million. The club would struggle to break even in the short to medium term so an contingency fund of around Ł40million would be need to prevent the club going back into administration. A share issue might raise some working capital lets say 30 million. It still looks like deep pockets for any buyer.

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26 Apr 2012 22:50:13
Big news all over twitter is that TBK and Kennedy have submitted a joint bid and will be named as pref bidders. It was tweeted by rangers media

Believable16 Unbelievable21

Big news my aunt fanny, they have not done any such thing

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This is unfounded there will be no joint bid, neither have any capital and Murray is now viewed as not a viable option

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Twitter ?

I only get radio Alba, what's been happening with Rangers ?

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Aye an Elvis and Michael Jackson are riding into Ibrox on the back of Shergar to do a benefit gig, get real!

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Why are people making this up to knock us back down its untrue

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Its on the back page of the record. Thats why i posted it.

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Why do we want someone who was part of the old regime back in again. He has no money and was part of the board that ruined us so for me why not try something new . Unfortunately this means liquidation but I thin kit is a fresh start and gets rid of all the mess and people that were involved previously including Paul Murray. I suppose he is claiming to be duped

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The OP is 100% correct on this one. Kennedy and Murray close to agreeing joint bid

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/football/spl/rangers/2012/04/27/rangers-in-crisis-brian-kennedy-paul-murray-close-to-agreeing-joint-bid-to-rescue-club-from-the-brink-86908-23839027/

Things possibly starting to go right?

Stu1872

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Thanks to the above post. I would not have posted it if it was not coming from some sort of source.

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26 Apr 2012 22:46:51
Bill miller has withdrawn bid, due to publicity & dnp handling of bid
Bye bye

Believable13 Unbelievable17

Bill Miller is an attention seeking American who probably thinks a football is shaped like an egg.

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Whatever happened to the little inscrutable chap with the unpronoucable surname ?

I believe he was foreign.

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I would not find it surprising if it is true. What must he be thinking after listening to recent comments from employees and former employees of the Club - they may be making comments with the best of intentions but I don't think they have helped matters one iota.

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What bid? He never made any bid that had a hope of being accepted and he knew that fine well.

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26 Apr 2012 22:27:28
The real story is uncontrolled capitalism - David Murray borrowed from Bank of Scotland £900million. Astonishing figure. The London Governments investigation into BOS collapse was finished and reported last month.
The British taxpayer had to write off £160billion to save the bank. It almost brought down Lloyd's.
Murray is increasingly being evidenced as an incompetent businessman as much as his friend at BO'S has been proven to be an incompetent Banker.
The running of Rangers was financially incompetent. Murray and his board did not deliver on the requirements of Directors in Scotland. They failed in their duties to shareholders, to employees, to fans and to taxpayers. And you want this board back?

Believable28 Unbelievable7

From 1989 to 2011 Rangers had negative cash flow of -Ł179million. The club was clearly insolvent under David Murray.

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David Murray is a failed businessman. His businesses have been overly heavily indebted for decades. They are being run by Bankers as he is not competent to do so.

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If Scotland was independent, BOS would have bankrupted the country for 300 years.
RBS would have bankrupted us for 125 years.

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900 Million is nowhere near 160 Billion, a thousand million is a billion. Companys take out loans a lot more than that. {Ed001's Note - a British billion is actually a million million, it is a US billion that is a thousand million.}

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Is Dave King suing SDM for Ł25m on behalf of Rangers? He had a 2 page spread in the DR a few weeks ago saying he was and the money was going to Rangers.

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SDM's knighthood on Wikipedia, was for services to business in Scotland. He received it at the height of his EBT tax avoidance strategy. Not paying his British corporate taxes on employees. His companies including Rangers were indebted to Ł900m to the incompetent BO'S whom Lloyd's have said the majority of loans would never have been made by Lloyd's.
This knighthood is heavily tainted. The mess he's left Rangers in is a betrayal, in SDM we trusted.

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Comrade bear,

Oh great,we have gone from blaming SDM to CW to HMRC to Ally, to D&Ps to TBKs to channel 4, to the BBC, to the SPL, to the SFA and now its uncontrolled capitalism.

Adam Smith is dead, thankfully the residents of Kirkcaldy will not need police protection.

Only kidding.

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Paul Murray was a Director and failed us also.

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Ed your wrong one thousand million is a billion: 1,000,000,000. {Ed001's Note - yes, an American billion, I am not wrong. I am never wrong, but this time I am right. I did once think I got something wrong, but it turned out I was mistaken....}

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Different financial circumstances and a different financial climate prevent Rangers from going into debt again anytime soon.

No one will lend them money for a few years, it will be a cash up front business.

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A billion is a thousand million in UK from 1974 I think. Bit of a grey area depending on who uses what scale. I think when they talk of peoples wealth its short scale us version. May be wrong though. {Ed001's Note - it was later than 1974, it was still being taught in school when I went, I wasn't born until 1974. It is like the gallon, it is just two different versions, but we seem to have accepted the US version for mainstream use, unfortunately. I detest Americanisms.}

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Ed,

I hate to say this but you may be wrong, the British billion disappeared n 1974 when we adopted the short scale( American billion).

Anorak. {Ed001's Note - not according to the school I went to.}

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Cw has more money than that hes got wealth off the scale lol

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Maybe it was a history class.

NW..aka...Anorak. {Ed001's Note - hahaha. Or out of touch teachers?}

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I'm with Ed. I was born in 1977 and I too was taught that a billion is a million million. Although the American short scale billion is now widely used as the worldwide standard, the difference is still there between a British English billion and an American billion. GOOGLE IT!
How dare they doubt you Ed, tut tut.
weetam1888 {Ed001's Note - cheers mate, glad to know I wasn't the only one taught it!}

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Actually BOS debt to the UK taken over by Lloyd's was Ł260billion! = Ł260,000,000,000. ( adding another the zero's million million, makes it a trillion.)
The BOS guy retired with a few billion himself and received no penalties. Perhaps Rangers should sue him for lending them money they could never repay?

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As a certain present Glasgow club manager stated in 1994 "I can't say I'm not enjoying it" This all wonderful stuff.

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Can we draw a line under the billion debate and declare BOS owed a lot of money, which is ziillions.

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Well ed seeing as your never wrong well agree to disagree. But it does seem the majority of people and businesses use American short version. Trash if you ask me! {Ed001's Note - they do use it, I fully agree on that, it is a lot easier if everyone does use the same one after all.}

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There is no such thing as a zillion. The correct term is gazillion.

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26 Apr 2012 22:05:10
Paul Murray met Brian Kennedy this afternoon and they've submitted a joint offer. Straight fae the horses mouth. I know one of the blue knight's. {Ed022's Note -

Believable21 Unbelievable19

What horse is that is it mr ed he talked... aye mate cause ur in the know ......
craig+babybear

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Wrong. The story actually is this: Paul Murray offered Brian Kennedy a smoke of a joint this afternoon. Kennedy replied "Naw big man, no until efter the BGT". FACT!

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Let me guess, you are the horse in question and Paul Murray rode you down to the ice cream van to cash in his ginger bottles.

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Tims on here are hilarious, maybe they should take up comedy, atleast it would be a job

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My mate's one of the blue knights and posted it on facebook. It's a done deal. U heard it here first bears.

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You must feel extremely privileged to have received this information.

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Has whyte agreed to sell his shares?

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Brian Kennedy made an offer for Paul Murray's joint. And he accepted.

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I dont believe this rumour.

Horses can not talk. {Ed001's Note - have you never seen the horse whisperer?}

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I know one o the blue knights aunties sister n law an she sez her cousin who once clapped Brian Kennedys dog saw a blue UFO land in the car park and take some Audis away!

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Not true...blue knights waiting on ibrox paper bill details to see if they can afford to take company on

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Pual Murray proved his worth when his consortium was asked for a deposit to become the long awaited Preferred Bidder. His consortiums of knights declined blaming Ticketus. If there is a joint bid, then when it fails to materialise, Mr P [Defender of the Faith] Murray can blame Mr Kennedy to ensure his blue persona is not tainted.

Mr P Murray was a member of the old regieme who had a blame culture when something went wrong, and he is till doing it.

There is not a true bear about who would not remorgage their house if they thought they could take control at Ibrox, and lead the club through these dark times.

Why can't Mr P Murray take the lead and liquidate his assets!

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Why can't Mr P Murray take the lead and liquidate his assets!
----------------------------------------This is not Jonestown, we don't want hundreds of supporters self-liquidating, stop drinking the Kool Aid.

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"Tims on here are hilarious, maybe they should take up comedy, atleast it would be a job"

We cant take up comedy, as nothing is funnier than rangers (in administration) going to the wall.

Enjoy the 3rd Division
TonyBhoy

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26 Apr 2012 21:42:21
We bit of an insight into the claims that were made by Duff & Duffer to the courts if anyone hasn't read it makes some interesting reading if the claims are true then it seems pretty damning on the part of Collyer Bristow and Gary Withey though am obviously not a legal expert so cant say for sure. Though if the claims are true then this has to be serious fraud with jail sentences dished out at the end. The only problem is are we going to be liquidated before this case is even heard?

http://www.thelawyer.com/full-extent-of-rangers-fc-claims-against-collyer-bristow-laid-bare/1012303.article

AH72

Believable17 Unbelievable6

Lol, complete nonsense. Ticketus paid whyte and whyte bought your club end od, aided by D&P

stop typing complete nonsense.

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As I understand it, the lawyers misrepresented the unconditional nature of the funds. The funds were in fact conditional on CW owning Rangers.
Technically speaking, the funds presented as a condition of the sale did not actually exist until after the sale.

SDM is praying it all blows over, he could end up with his old company back and its debt.

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Don't let the paranoia get in the way of the truth

bill72

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Eh.......pot.....kettle........!?!?!?!?

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To the above post, you have no basic understanding of the legal system then, the solicitors claimed to have the money in heir acc before the deal with ticketus was completed. Fraud, end of!

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This is all nonsense, its the rangers straw clutch brigade, your club was sold to whyte, it does not matter where he got the cash. you are just paying more money to d&p who were involved in the takeover.

Rangers will be liquidated, fact, its the actual date that's hard to call.

another point, do you think intimidation aids an appeal case.

if it does, Scottish football is finished.

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It actually does matter if the cash did not exist at the point of sale, and it could not have existed.
CW could not have sold advanced tickets for a club he did not own.

The sale of Rangers was on condition that 24 million of funds were available, and the 24 million did not become available until AFTER the sale.

SDM does not want to give CW his pound back, trust me.

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Think thats why Gary Withey done a runner because he's falsified documents stating that Whyte had 27million in holding with Collyer and Bristow at the time of sale which he didn't. This is how the police have a handwriting expert come into the senario

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Whyte bought Rangers for a pound. One of the conditions of the sale was that he pay off the bank debt. Basically as long as he didnt borrow the pound from ticketus he is legally in the clear.

Murray wanted proof that he could pay off the debt but it was Murray who made Whyte aware that Ticketus could provide funding based on season ticket sales.

Dont you think if Whyte could have been removed for an illegal takeover it would have happened by now?

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26 Apr 2012 20:17:25
Audis were gettin taken away from ibrox today I take it to be company cars or somethin. Not very interesting but thought I'd post it.

Believable12 Unbelievable9

Total p!sh post something worth will ... Kenny bluenose

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It was on the Rangers website 6 weeks ago that Audi were sticking by the club and had delivered a new fleet so I very much doubt they would be back collecting them.

The Pilot! {Ed001's Note - unless they were taking away old ones that were being replaced with new?}

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The tax was due

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Seen them taken away today about 12 oclock

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Last home game, car park at Copland road end had half a dozen new mercs with players plates on them

Nothing new here move on

bill72

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Saw two dozen Bentley convertibles arriving at 2pm

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Saw two dozen Benley convertibles being returned at 3pm wrong colour they were green

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New Mercs? the German consortium are back....

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26 Apr 2012 19:57:59
Rangers (in administration), Ally McCoist and the fans of this club are a disgrace. The sooner they shut the place down, the better for all. I cant wait for them to be liquidated, I really cant.
to the guy that posted this ridiculous statement,mcoist a disgrace? his comments first and foremost were as a rangers fan,which is also on the minds of most rangers fans out there.arent you forgetting the antics of your own manager mr lemmon,numerous reports to the sfa regarding his conduct and comments.what a hippocrite.mcoist has every right to voice his opinnion. {Ed022's Note - So you believe Ally was fine to say what he did?}

Believable24 Unbelievable20

Of course Ally had every right to say what he did Great Britain is a democracy and has the right to free speech or does the incompetent and corrupt SFA have a dictators view on that as well

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Too right we think he was correct in what he said as he is the only one who can speak for us fans and voice how we are all feeling.
No one is looking for any sympathy from the other clubs but we wont go without a fight so bring it on! {Ed001's Note - than you are an idiot too. He already knew who they were, so he was obviously trying to get cretins like you onside.}

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Well said ed..........

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ED022;sadly he does..........green jhedi

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I smell a Timmy, we will see how long the rest of the clubs in THE PL last without the most sucessful club in history

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I see Walter Smith is in the press deflecting the conversation from Ally. He says Rangers cannot be relegated as all SPL teams would suffer. That's like saying Rangers are too big to be punished properly ever! You can't punish Rangers at any point in the future ever, because it will be bad for the SPL. This from the guy who said last week that Rangers was extremely well run before Whyte arrived. Lies or what?

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Ed 022, are you a Rangers fan ? {Ed022's Note - Afraid not.}

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Resorting to name calling Ed001....its not big and its not clever For your information im neither an idiot nor a cretin but if it makes you happy carry on. {Ed022's Note - I'm randy.}

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Lets get this straight, no football club is bigger than the association they are affiliated to. The association is bigger than any one member and can survive without any one member.

A football team can not play against itself.

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No one stirs up hate among their fans nore than celtic f.c. Perhaps Ally wanted a reaction from fans or the press, perhaps his comment was put across wrong, but I dont believe for one minute Ally wanted anyone threatened. Ally dont do hatered the way Celtic do....Catweazle-talkingbone.

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Well i for 1 will not be going to ibrox if they botcott my club ...if rangers keep up these stupid ideas the rest of the spl should boycott the sfa ...rangers need the spl more than they need them just know ...my club hasnt caused any of rangers problems .ps ally is only showing his true colors now the pressure is on ..KTID

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I bet Walter was on the EBT aswell as Sal and D Murray.
Hypocrites.

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Your views make you seem like a cretin.

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Ed you are an honest man i hope the morons who follow rangers dont know your name.ps maciost might demand to know who you are mate {Ed022's Note - Its in my job description mate, as well as Ed001's. We must be honest, or have our genitals removed by a hungry ants nest.}

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Of course he was correct. The decision to punish any potential new owner for the blatant theft and lies of Craig whyte are ridiculous. This decision to ban transfers could contribute to hundreds of people losing their livelihood. Surely these people many who have no interest in football deserve to know who has jeopardised their job and why. The threats are a disgrace but mcoist

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I am afraid since Ally knew who the panel were, his comment " who are these people " could be construed as arrogant or inflammatory. Either way it was hardly a measured response to a penalty under appeal.

A simple statement echoing D&Ps objections would have been more appropriate.


Characters are best judged in adversity, and in the case of Ally, the jury is out.

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A like how ally says something and all the timmys out there r saying he is a disgrace but there manager makes a disgrace of him self every time celtic get beat buy all ways saying the ref cheated never saying that they were just not the better team that day so all the celtic fans should look at there own manager before talking about any othere manager

SM

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No one with any common sense is saying we shouldn't be punished this seems to be what all the timmys are jumping on, what we are asking for is for the SFA to take into consideration the current position the club is in which they don't seem to be doing.
Like walter smith has suggested a transfer ban could be suspended for 6 or 12 months to give any potential new owner a chance to rebuild from what has been the worst few months in Rangers history and could undoubtedly damage all clubs in the SPL in the long run and anyone who says it wouldn't is dillusional.
Like saying if Barca weren't in La Liga then it would make no difference to Real?

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Ally has just proven he is way out his depth!
Great player , poor manager , terrible judge. That was a very bad call and lost any chance of sympathy in many quarters.

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ED spot on with the comment on the knuckle dragger posts,you should save your breath its these idiots that Sleekit Sally is trying to appeals to,say what you want about lennon he is honest and if he had said this the press would have hung dried and quartered him . lets wait for the SFA to grow a pair if Ally does not walk they should throw the book at him

Dannybhoy {Ed001's Note - I am not so sure Lennon is any better personally, but I understand what you are saying.}

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David Mutrray and his director nodding dogs are the true villans.
The damage was done over the last glorious 10 years.

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Barca and Rangers thats like saying the Rolling Stones and Showadywady.

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I do not see this penalty threatening the sale, and if it doesn't threaten the sale, then there is no disadvantage to the SPL, only Rangers.

Rangers can not expect things to go back to normal within half a season for this degree of mayhem. Missing out on domestic success for one year and European entry for two years, is hardly overkill.

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Well said ed you are correct its cretins like that who follow our club tarnish its good name no wonder a small section of our support always blacken our name well said ed we dont need these morons supporting our great club {Ed001's Note - every club has them to be fair.}

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Yeah cos i was comparing Rangers to Barca that was exactly my point.....eh naw.
Another Troglodyte with nothing to contribute but sarcasm, there's a reason they call it the lowest form of wit!

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DannyBOY. Your knuckledragging comment just shows you as the same as our idots. sorry.

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Ally is suggesting the SFA penalty puts at risk any bid, and RFC are not responsible for the owners actions.

I believe he is wrong on both counts, is he suggesting that the SFA penalise SDM and not Rangers for the soon to be confirmed EBT illegalities ?

Do the SFA strip SDM of trophies or ban SDM from Europe or give him a 10 point penaty for the next two years ?

Any businessman worth his salt will have a business plan that anticipates and incorporates such penalties.

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Why on earth shouldnt those be named who have made these judgements. Too many times un-named faceless people set the rules and as judge and jury then they should be named. Im no cretin and yes the ones who threatened these people are. But what IF these people who are making these decisions have a personal agenda against this club or any club in the future.As we all know majority of people do not have much faith in the SFA

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26 Apr 2012 18:07:31
McCoist in trouble from Whyte who is
the owner, been told to resign of will
be sacked.

Who all stood back when Whyte was
not paying PAYE!

Many people at RFC could have
spoke up, we need the names of
all these people who knew it would
end this way...

Believable24 Unbelievable14

Sometimes it is best if people don't air their views - Walter you are wrong for supporting Ally when he knew the names look what has happened now. Ally should go!

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Pure tripe

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A pint of what you are on please. Whyte is not running the club or have you been asleep for the last three months

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Are you on drugs - "super ally in trouble from Craig Whyte who is the owner". Anyways that made me smile.

Gers1986

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This is utter rubbish for obvious reasons

Craig Whyte is powerless to sack anyone while the club is in administration!

Think before ye post tripe.

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Ask ally he will get you the names. hes good at this kind of thing.

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D&P have the power from the court to sack Ally as the Managers of Rangers.
He should be sacked. But I don't want him sacked because he's Pish and hell always put his foot in his mouth.

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Has Ally apologised yet?

Such dignity! {Ed022's Note - He hasn't apologised, but made a rather pathetic attempt at retracting his comments by saying the fans have taken it out of context. In my opinion he needs to stay silent for a bit.}

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Yu forget d+p work for whyte he is slaging whyte he will now be sacked

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Coisty leavin after old firm game anyway!

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Give ally a break he didnt mean anything out of context give the man a break he is a young manager

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Sack ally and the team would walk no chance ally mite sack cw

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Ed0222. Can we have ED001 back? {Ed001's Note - naw, you are stuck with 022.....}

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26 Apr 2012 17:38:07
I've heard that a investment company from England has just bought a gym in Barrhead (from someone who goes there)
And it is rumoured that this somehow will play a part in next season's Rangers youths training.
Sounds far-fetched to me

bluebill

Believable9 Unbelievable9

There isn't a gym in Barrhead, unless you go to the sports centre!

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What a lot of tripe there is only one gym in Barrhead as I live here and know the gym that is here is like a porto cabin so doubt it !!

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In other words, training Rangers first team

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First team?

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Well there was another gym in barrhead, but eh that got burned down. Why lie?

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You've got it wrong . Due to the transfer embargo Rangers have bought 17 year old Jim from Barrhead for next season .....DH

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This is true. My mate's dog whistled the news to me in code this afternoon.

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The sports center ownership did change hands last week, this must be what is being referred to but it has nothing to do with the Gers as far as I know

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Rangers benefited for 10 to 15 years so the sanctions should be for 10 to 15 years. As for paying other clubs so that the transfer ban gets lifted, what about the other creditors.

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26 Apr 2012 17:04:04
To all the fools that believe half these ridiculous rumours could you please send me all your bank details and I will credit your account with £1000 free of charge.

Campsie Tim {Ed022's Note - Great post.}

Believable25 Unbelievable5

Sort code 12-34-56 acc number 789987789 now im off to book my hols dont let me down now --cooper boy

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Already been done mate,its called the rangers fighting fund !!!!

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How about contacting the fighting fund and getting a list of the contributors account details?

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My details are: Craig Whyte, Bank of Monte Carlo, A/C No: 1872-2012

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No way Craig

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Hi Campsie, that sounds like a fantastic offer. Can you please post your real name and contact details so I can send you all my banking information. I thought Donald Trump buying Rangers was the highlight of my day but a free grand... Waw.

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Let's just call it a loan

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Im gutted my team ive followed since i was a kid seems to be dead i cant follow any other team if they go i will have no team i back mccoist 100% so sad if i had the money i would save us hope some one will

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Mccoist tipped for the barca job where my 1000 pound!!

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To' Im gutted my team' i do feel sorry for you mate but remember no one has died over this and long may that be the case.

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Ł1000 Before or after tax...

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Rangers tried that old one with the taxman. dont know how they got on

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26 Apr 2012 16:23:21
I am hearing from a reliable source....
That Craig Whyte will be buying a small English Team, maybe Banstead with the intention of rebranding the club from the lower English Leagues.
With the intention of moving the club into the lower regions of the English Leagues and over the space of a decade have the little known club playing in the Premier League with the big boys.
This must have been what he
meant as describing when he
announced history would show him as the saviour of Rangers, he would not be banned as it would be in the English League set up.....


p.s ED I sent this yesterday and never had it published.... {Ed022's Note - I have no idea why such an insightful post would be so wrongly ignored.}

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That'll be a bit of a treck for fans will it no? better aff goin up the Jags!

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"history will show me as a saviour" dear oh dear , the quote of favour by nearly every terrorist !
PaulRFC

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You got to keep on taking your medication!
My god what next !

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New to the Rumours site? It shows.

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That was my idea last week. But alas, not Craig Whyte's style.

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I believe this post is utter nonsense... Its one of those ones where you have taken a rumour, added your own twist, then made it sound even more ridiculous. That being said, I have also heard whispers about buying over some english minnows and rebranding. Just the usual fairytale stuff.

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Assume Banstead will need to refund that Ł250k CW sent them for the new academy that just happened to be paid via Collyer Bristow not long after they received the Ticketus money. Just a coincedence of course and all above board.

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Hello hello we are the BANSTEAD BOYS, sounds good

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Your source is correct , a visionary mr whyte is and not working alone.....

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Well done! The second part of the Whyte/Ticketus master plan. The Ł250000 that they sent to Banstead last year was for this very reason. I have posted many times that Whyte and Ticketus are the same. This is the next part of the newco plan.

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Oh Dear! so so sad, to be a Rangers fan!

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What a great plan.

"Hello hello my friends in Glasgow, Craig Whyte here. Sorry I completely destroyed your club but since you now don't have a team to support why don't you all come down to London every weekend and support me on my latest money making venture?"

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Id like to hear more about the Whyte ticketus masterplan. He'd better get it going. Cos he's doing a bloody good cover up .

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The master plan has been in front of all your eyes all along. A piece of genius to tell the truth. Let's go through it slowly, for the hard of intelligence. Are we to believe that Ticketus gave a total stranger 24 million pounds? No? Well let's carry on. The 24 million and one pound secured the floating charge, meaning in liquidation ibrox came into Ticketus whytes hands. Whyte the man became rangers owner , he registered a new company name of "Glasgow rangers" in England. He also passed Ł250000 through colleyers bristow to Banstead athletic, in their 10 of the English pyramid. This will be used to fund the legal transition. All the evidence had been in front of everyone for the past 11 months. A belter of a job by mr craig Whyte. Utterly outstanding.

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Probably ignored yesterday because its nonsense.

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Reading this thread reminds me of when the office first came out. I didn't get it at first. I thought it was serious before realizing it was a comedy. God you guys have got it bad man..that said can't really blame you as the family have been informed and the priest is on his way!

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26 Apr 2012 15:46:39
rangers are driving sponsers away as i work in the banking industry and reason CLYDESDALE

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Clydesdale announced months ago not renewing sponsor, old news and nothing to do with Rangers

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Clydesdale are SPL sponsors. Nothing to do with Rangers.

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LOL, You clearly dont because you cannot speak about the stuff, Also Rangers are trying to save themselves, The SFA and SPL brong this on themselves, ridiculous sanctions and clearly the sponsors see it as a reason to leave.

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Maybe something that rhymes with "banker" would be a better description!
PaulRFC {Ed022's Note - Tanker? Chanker? Ranker? I'm so confused!}

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So, you work in a bank and cant spell SPONSORS. really says it all about our generation......

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What does a big hairy horse have to do with Rangers?

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Unless its a big hairy WHYTE horse lmao

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What a tool you are you obviously don't read the papers national bank of Australia is trying to sell the Clydesdale bank! Never mind rangers chasing supporters away, you should be chased back over to your own rumours page dim Tim!

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Its not only bankers who can't spell - brong sounds wrong!

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YOU work in the banking industry and you want people to listen to you ? ha ha good one...........

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They want to harm all clubs because they will soon be liquidated.

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Why is it that if you disagree with anyone on this site you are labelled a tim? I aint no tim and i disagree with 95% o the pish thats written on it.

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26 Apr 2012 13:47:40
Celtic to start sale of squad players on Sunday R.Ibrahiem is the first to be punted and will be put in the shop window on Sunday news that has been leaked to all English first div scouts

Believable15 Unbelievable37

Why would you post that on a Rangers rumours page?

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I smell a bit of craig whyte here considerin he may end up startin against yous lot on sunday lol

paddybhoy

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As a rangers fan i know this to be untrue, my nephew plays with celtic u 19s and if you read my post on the celtic site, you will see that my nephew has said he is very highly thought of at celtic and is being blooded for a few matches, before being used next season.

BluePeter

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Em, so?

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Only sale is at Ibrokes mate. Everything for a pound

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What a load of cobblers.i read blue peters post and will believe him im afraid.........green jhedi

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Who cares

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If it it true.i dont think so. then celtic put a price on him. not some admin mob. the money will go towards BUYING more players for the CL. dont know why am putting it on here. yous dont know the meaning of these words

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..Firesale at porkheid could well be true..what with no tv deal...no real competition...and no much interest in a one horse race the wage bill at celtic will have to be cut drasticaly and quickly..the end is nigh for the spl....you heard it here first...

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Celtic will sell some fringe players and bring others in , makes good business sense, they won't pay stupid transfer fees or over pay wages , pity Rangers didn't follow this policy

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Celtic will collapse without Rangers....

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I love the spin on this post.

It is TUCKER like :)

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Above post why u so bothered about us mate cant live with uis cant live without us lol

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Celtic need rangers....... rangers need celtic FACT {Ed022's Note - Couldn't agree more.}

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Always look on the bright side of life!

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'Celtic will collapse without Rangers' at least you my old son have accepted that Rangers are DEAD!

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Laughable the original poster is on a rangers site, I swear some of these Bhoys are bears are heart, he he

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Well rangers won't be buying him or any other player,if this is the case,so why post this?rangers are in a terrible state right now and don't need to know what celtic are up to,wise up and support your own team get behind them,celtic are champions and worthy of what they have acheived,the whole rangers squad could be up for sale at the end of the season ffs bobby

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26 Apr 2012 13:34:57
Just been told Rangers maybe better of starting over, and could start under the name Glasgow fc. And play in light and dark blue hooped top, has will loss the right to play in its original club colours. and everything of the old film will have to be sold on naming rights everything to clear debts. This person who told me said he works has an accountant and heard it from senior Rangers accountants.

Believable25 Unbelievable40

Must've been a Chinese whisper Old Film indeed

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How can you lose the right to play in a certain colour? and how can you sell the "naming rights" for the Old Firm unless its to another team called Rangers and they play Celtic, truly horrendous post, were you just on your lunch break and thought you put up this p1sh

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Sorry am I missing something here,if this is true why would they need to sell naming rights etc to clear debts. Surely if this Is a completely new company there would be no debt. Pennyboy

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Wow...they even know what colors they'll be playing in! I'm impressed...less impressed with the explanation though. The colours of a football club are not patented. They were invented by the big bang and are free to use all the way through to the big crunch!
I'd say "nice try, timmy!" but it clearly isn't so I won't...

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Aye wee davies dugs pals grannies aunties cousins dads brother fae saltcoats was sayn that aswel,....govan_front87

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I dont know why anybody replies to a--sholes that post krap like that on here doug

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This might be the same idiot who posted that the Hectors would resign from the spl this morning.. still don't think he has taken his medicines...anyway why would a newco wanted any name other than something with Rangers in it....does this idiot think us bhoys would then cheer or converted to a club just carrying the city name....Hectors will return as a newco...might take them a few years to be a strong as they where....but the banter between Celtic & rangers will continue.....

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Hey govan_front87 im fae saltcoats and i agree never heard that rumour doon here i am goven front as well so if i hear anything more sock colours etc ill give you shout at the next home game youve got to laugh at some of these posts please the guy or girl responsible for this post take an asprin crawl back below yir bed as long as you stay out of direct sunlight youll be ok glasgow fc ,light and dark blue HOOPS yir e--e

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Somehow u dont thin someone from rangers accounts would be leaking that sort of info out to people! lets just wait & see what the future holds for the club

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Just to let you know lads gers fan living in newcastle contrary to what that mob would lead you to believe we have the support of loads of decent football fans down here who cant believe how we are being treated

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How is Snowy ?

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I think they are going to paly in a pick top with brown shorts. Just what I heard dont know if it is true

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, i wonder how wee snowys doin, wonder if hes been getn fed? Well am from stevenston n wee tams pals sisters uncle billy was sayn he had read it in the ardrassan saltcoats, page 5 a think it was, if a hear anythn else m8 will give u a shout my fellow govan front neighbour,....govan_front87

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Ho govan_front87 sorry i must withdraw that post if its in the ardrossan ans saltcoats herald it must be true thought that would have made the front page but just shows how the mighty have fallen well its light and dark blue HOOPS for us then

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Total crap, obviously composed by some halfwit. Old Firm, Rangers et al are not patented commodities, they could however be copyrighted, particularly the Rangers brand. Check out the difference between copyright and patent and you can get the jist.

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To the OP, I might be wrong here but being that we're currently in Admin due to debt etc, pretty sure the Rangers accountants have been given the boot being that they are ultimately responsible for the books being balanced, taxes etc are deducted and clearly they were p**h poor at that so logic would suggest that the only people currently administering accounts at the club are in fact the administrators and can't see them having plans for new club and kits and what not when their only job is to find a buyer for the club. As i said I may be wrong about that and happy to be corrected but I'm pretty sure that your original post is nonsense mate but again happy for you to prove me wrong.
Jay
TrueBlue

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Nonsensical post

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26 Apr 2012 12:36:37
Just to pull away from the Mccoist debate for a moment. which he shouldnt have said but i dont think the strain is taking its toll, you can see in his appearance alone. none of us were happy with the judgement but he didnt need to do that interview.

why havent the sfa havent had to answer to anyone about not pursuing craig whyte for a fit and proper persons test.

they tried, he never co-operated, then they left it at that??

they have a bigger part to answer in all of this. the whyte scenario couldve been "controlled" back then instead of exploding like this now

that is negligence on thier part and could see their biggest club sank.

ryanrfc

Believable22 Unbelievable26

I totally agree with you ryanrfc, i have no idea why sfa let cw take over club without follow following through with sfa fit and propper test...jsm

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I meant the strain is taking its toll btw

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Good post mate the SFA should take some responsability for not checking craig whyte

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You seem to be suggesting that the SFA should punish themselves for not doing their due dilligence on Craig Whyte?

I'm sure D&P have considered this as that would have made them culpable in CW being allowed to take control of the club last year, and maybe compensation would be due. But neither party has mentioned this so I think we can assume that it's a non-starter.

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Sorry second biggest club. Whyte is the owner and not an office holder hence the reason he has put the two fingers up to the SFA fine and can continue to be the owner.

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Their biggest club is Celtic. I am a neutral but for the past 10 seasons Celtic have had the highest average attendance and turnover in Scotland. I dont know where this "biggest club" nonsense comes from. Rangers have won the most domestic trophies however.

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Eh excuse me, but given the vitriolic reaction of the moronic thuggish element of Rangers fans when the BBC put out a documentary telling the truth about Whyte, I think if the SFA had done that, the moronic thuggish element who shame Rangers week in week out would have gone mental.

In any event, rightly or wrongly, the SFA had a policy where it was up to the club to self certificate, the club failed in that task which is why we are in trouble over this.

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The fit & proper person test is self-regulating as it stands. It is the Club's responsibility, in the first instance, to establish whether an individual meets the criteria.

Now you can argue whether self-regulation is appropriate, but at the end of the day that's the current set-up.

Therefore, it is RANGERS fault and the reason they were charged.

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And the big elephant in the room
SDM - will he also get banned from football???

or are we not allowed to comment?

bill72

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Everybodys fault but your own eh? You lot are unbelievable. The SFA have absolutely no jurisdition in who OWNS a club.

Swallow your medicine and deal with it. You have been cheating and scamming for years. All the chickens are coming home to roost now and you dont like what you see!

TonyBhoy

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Sometimes one just has to put their hand up and admit its their own fault.

The main responsibility lies with SDM the previous owner of Rangers, why did he not vet CW, he hung about like a bad smell for 10 months of due diligence.

You can't blame the SFA.

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Who sold the club, the SFA?

No, it was David Murray, who has the honour of ensuring that Craig Whyte was 'fit and proper'.

He didn't and you couldn't see him for dust as his car sped away, as he knew what was coming.

Why have we not heard anything from David Murray on this whole fiasco.

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We got to look at the big picture here why did sdm not do checks before selling the club for ! pound ? why was there no checks done by the governing bodies ? why were the fans not told of the debts being mounted up yearly to me its sounds like a quick sale wash your hands of the club its all been underhand dealing and wheeling not a fit way to run a football club what would our great pioneers of the club be thinking of this people like mr struth who was well regarded in scottish football respected by rangers and celtic fans it seems like the directors of the last 12 to 15 years could not fill the boots of previous custodians of our club thats how we are in this mess today total mismanagement to the core

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The SFA only pulled out the "Fit & Proper" stuff AFTER the BBC documentary. Until then, they couldn't give a toss.

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Ryan did Mr Murray not set up a committee? Did Alaister Johnstone not say in public that he advised Mr Murray not to sell to Mr Whyte only to be told "to late" did other directors at that time not say that Mt Whyte was not fit and proper? Did Private eye not publish an article about Mr Whyte BEFORE he bought the club has no one got access to GOOGLE How many warnings do you need

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Listen you. The SFA are the governing body and have to take a little responsibility for who is the owner of any club in scotland.

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Just to anyone who thinks i am saying we shouldnt be punished - yes we should. but we shouldnt be repeadedly booted when we are down. motherwell and dundee only suffered points deductions. we should be made to pay our creditors as much as we can.
And i think you'll find we are the biggest club in scotland - more titles, more players registered for the national team than anyone else, in the last ten years plus - we have contributed more points to scotlands co-effiecent than any of scotlands other teams.

Murray should be banned - that wouldnt bother him either though.

and about the bbc documentary - regardes of fans "going mental" the sfa should have pursued a fit and proper persons test if he wasnt co-operating - he should never have held office at rangers - im not talking about owning im talking about running.

The sfa certainly dont care about fans "going mental" when they are handing out absolutly ridiculous decisions

ryanrfc

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Rangers fans are complaining about the SFA not upholding the rules and upholding the rules.

You just can't win.

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Here we go, "we're victimised" the SFA is against us, etc, etc.

If the SFA had any real powers, both rangers and celtic would be booted for their sectarian views, but, they let that one go.

If Rangers are going to have a dig at the SFA, then they should exit, stage left, and, cease to become members (which is becoming more likely anyway).

That's like saying, I'm part of society but don't like the rules, so will break the law....

In fact, that's what Rangers did.

You cannot get round the fact that in the 'rush' to buy success you broke and bent the rules.

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Ryan,

I have no axe to grind against Rangers, but the scale and number of rules they have broken means they will continue to receive punishments for some time to come. I would prepare yourself (in the event Rangers survive) for more bans in Europe, more SPL fines and more point deductions.

It doesn't matter how important Rangers are to the association, Rangers can not play on their own, they are not MORE important than the association they are a member of.

Anyway good luck...NW.

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To the guy who mentioned the sfa upholding rules.

its ok for them to uphold thier rules and even go beyond what was necessary

but they dont have to play by their own rules ?

my starting point was valid.

im not blaming the sfa for the transaction between whyte and murray, they are both conmen and hate figures now. but the sfa just like any other fa should have followed up with a fit and proper persons test

sfa - corrupt
whyte - corrupt
murray - corrupt
collyer bristow - corrupt


ryanrfc

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Has the Big Tax Case result been made public???? It must be as some of the posters on here have hung drawn and quartered Rangers as being guilty.

We cheated by paying money we never had..........excuse me, but that has not been ascertained yet therefore peoples views that Rangers cheated and paid money we never had are as null and void as selliks treble/double!!

Scunnered reading the same boring rubbish day in day out posted by the same dumplings day in day out!!

Stu1872

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Stu
Rangers have already lost the btc, the tribunal is set to announce the extent of the punishment!
Why can no one understand this?

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Ryan: if you believe they're all corrupt, report them to the police. Let us know how you get on. Accusing the SFA of corruption is pretty serious, though, and it should be dealt with. Please do your best to expose the governing body for all our sakes.

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Stu1872

After Whyte took over Rangers used money that should have been used to pay PAYE and national insurance to pay the club's running costs. That has been proven and is probably illegal.

If Whyte hadn't done that Rangers would have gone into administration last year and the bones of the squad would have been picked clean in the January transfer window.

The big tax case is a tribunal to decide on how much extra in interest/penalties is to be added to the Ł25 million core figure Rangers have ALREADY been found guilty of avoiding paying HMRC.

Given that another Ł25 million is due in interest I think its a fairly safe bet that they will be asked to pay that.

The other Ł25 million is potential penalties (penalties being calculated as a percentage of original amount, Ł25million obviously being the maximum 100%).

Ł25m core-Ł25 interest-Ł25 potential penalties

My money is on a figure between 55million-60million, the whole of the core amount and interest plus a penalty of 20-40%.

If I'm wrong about the figure I will hold my hands up and say so but the breakdown of figures relating to the Big Tax Case is correct and freely available.

Tell me Stu1872 what is your honest opinion on what the tax case verdict will be when it finally comes out?

For the record I am a Celtic fan but the last thing I want to see is Rangers disappear. Broke yes, gone no. I would hate to no longer have the banter with my Rangers supporting mates over the Old Firm games.

Mac

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Rangers have done wrong and should be punished accordingly but i do feel part blame lies with the sfa. They were also negligent in their duties regarding Craig Whyte if they could not get the information they wanted then he should never been allowed to take over Rangers not just let things slide then lock the stable door after the horse has bolted so to speak.

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Just what did you expect the SFA to do. If they had told you you WOULD NOT have believed them. If they had stopped whyte then right now the SFA would according to the reaction to the panel would be a smoking ruin right now.
Just what would you have said. For goodness sake you know ALL about Paul Murray and KNOW he doesnt meet the standards you want the sfa to have done last year and you STILL want Paul Murray as you saviour. Even when you know he has NO money.
GET A GRIP WILL YOU

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If the SFA had prevented the sale of a club that had been on the market for 2-3 years, then the Rangers fans would be demandng the heads of the SFA.

Its a tricky one.

NW.

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Rangers rumours page but choc full of everyone but rangers fans, guess you guys got tired of the Portsmouth page eh

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It was the Rangers board (including the leader of the blue knights) who should have looked at things not the SFA; if they had prevented the takeover - now admit it - threats or worse would have been made - FACT!

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I believe Rangers will not be liquidated and I do not blame the fans for any of this mess, but for the fans who wish to defend the indefensible I have no sympathy, you deserve everything you get.

For goodness sake just take your medecine like " you are the people ".

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Celtic are the biggest club, what are you on about pal? Biggest support, biggest stadium, healthiest bank account and largest world appeal. "watp", ye right!!!

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What a mess youve made Rangers board.

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26 Apr 2012 12:35:39
See the latest thing is that a reformed / new club would potentially not be allowed to join the SFL either as Cove Rangers and Spartans have both applied to join Division 3 beginning next season...

On a side note fans about the transfer ban... At the end of the day the club broke the rules, the same way that if we designed something that collapsed it would be our company that would suffer more than the individual. We deal with it and move on, the lawyers fees in appealing it etc will just cost us more and the legal team must be stretched ridiculously thin already... And plus, if by some miracle we get out of administration we're gonna have NO cash, and if we are seen to be spending money the CVA would get appealed by the creditors... Forces us to play youths who might actually make us money in a few years...

Believable29 Unbelievable10

Thats rubbish - all talk secretly their just waiting for us to form a newco - the rebel can spout its bile all it wants its been doing it for years - rangers taking mobs and mobs of fans to away grounds and filling out home games. the money we'd generate them in comparison to what they earn now is unreal. the money they recieve in bovril reciepts from us alone would triple their annual turnover lol

who would teams like east stirlingshire want to play cove rangers or glasgow rangers(in a 50 odd thousand all seater stadium)
ryanrfc

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Yes, newco must apply to the SPL. This has always been understood. So it's Rangers Mk2 versus Spartans etc for the spare place. Rangers Mk2 would have a good chance just as Gretna did, applying from outwith the structure at the time.

Joining SPL1 is not an option, however. Anyone comparing Scotland with Italy should note that Juventus were relegated to Liga 2 because the same organisation runs both divisions. That's the danger of having a "breakaway" SPL which must have seemed a good idea at the time.

One way Rangers Mk2 could play in SFL1 would be if it was reconstituted before 16 May and suffered a points penalty of 100 points or whatever, finishing bottom at the end of the 2011/2012 season. But that would need quick work from all parties so won't happen.

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Yes, Rangers Mk2 will be up against other applicants. The SFL will need to decide, and will probably go with Rangers. (Of the Galsgow not the Cove variety). Requires newco and application by a certain deadline though.

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This hurts to say this but a drop to div 3 seems the only way to save the club gutted bear

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You are mistaken, once the CVA is accepted the new owner can invest any amount of money he wishes or sell any assets he wishes, there is no comeback, the debt is cleared.

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Because they'd might beat them. The teams at the top won't want to be done out of the chance of promotion.

With regards to 50 thousand, if there was to be a newco the season tickets would be void, you honestly think we'd get anywhere near even a half-full Ibrox every week playing in the 3rd division. If we do manage to keep the stadium in all this we'll be lucky to be able to afford it...

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If we are not allowed to register with the SPL why dont we form a newco and join the English FA. Long term much better when moving up the leagues, and the FA stated that we could not join because we are member of the SFA. If they kick us out and we form a newco then why not do this and see how long they and the rest of the SPL/SFL teams survive without Rangers.......not too long.
Ritchie712

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Ritchie.....

let's see how long Rangers would survive in England?

Scottish football is at very best, poor English championship standard and at worst, about 2nd division (the old 4th).


How many 'loyal' bears are going to turn out for a midweek game against, let's say, Stevenage......assuming Rangers were admitted to the English Championship.

Or how many 'loyal' bears are going to make a 'pilgrimage' to an away fixture on a Sunday to say, Barnsley.

Get one thing straight, the English idea is dead and buried, while the gate receipts might suit those coming North, the hassle of having travelling 'hoards' coming South is not appealing to the English masses. I might mention a certain European Final in Manchester as an example.

The ONLY and best option is to suffer the consequences, and, start at Div 3. All things considered, you should be back in 4 years.

That is a better option, than not having a team at all surely?

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Survive what about kids who watch football on the telly,and listen to the sectarian bile,thats one thing that wont be missed.that to any decent person is more important than money,ban the fans to the third division and keep rangers in the premiere league,IF ONLY,

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There is more money in the English 3rd Div than our so called premier league, which is premier in name only. As for Barnsley, we could not afford one of their players not so long ago. Take Barnsley or Dunfermline, who in your opinion is the bigger club. I'd say Barnsley is between 10 and 20 times the size of most of the bottom half of our league and at least on a par with the top half, outside the Old Firm.

Ritchie 712

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Ritchie,

The English FA have strict rules also, there is no escaping regulation, stay here and take your medecine like a man.

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The SPL fans 92-98% of each SPL club who voted do not want Rangers in the SPL. The club boards must take heed of that. Regardless of financial impact.
Rangers cannot be too big to be punished properly.

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26 Apr 2012 11:32:55
the new stip is a belter , cant wait to get it, its a classic :) ...WATP.....jsm

Believable26 Unbelievable23

Nice but it's very plane .dc

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Hopefully we will have a team to support next season first and foremost!

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Yep white wae black arrows is aboot right.

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Do you think there is a reason as to why there is no longer 5 stars above the crest?

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It's pish. It's just a plain blue t shirt with a bigger Rangers badge on it. Looks like Duff and Phelps have had a hand in it's design. Cheap design, high cost, maximum profits.

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Its a cracker,

i just order the barca bears 72. shirt

never normally get names on the shirt but i think the one is worth it.

Goatboydundee..

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''Do you think there is a reason as to why there is no longer 5 stars above the crest?''

That, unfortunately, is not a bad observation.

CC

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The stars run down the sleave...yea it is plain but the big rangers crest is brilliant...and most important its still blue....jsm

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I see there is a shortage of stars above the RFC emblem.
Just realising the punishment about to come their way from the SPL.
There will also be a lot of bears out there requiring some tattoo laser removal as well.
Enjoy the pain on and off the park...

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I especially like that the tennents logo is so small and dosent take over the whole shirt...love it...jsm

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Well what do you know. The 5 star haters are back. It must be so painful being so bitter.

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Pure peach of a strip nice one

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"The stars run down the sleave"

That is a design feature - Peterhead could put stars down the sleeves of their tops if they wanted.

The significance is that they are not above the crest where all clubs carrying honours are eligible to have them...........seems significant.

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The 5 stars are still there but they run down the shoulder now. It doesnt matter how plain or otherwise it is because Rangers get a fixed amount from JJB for strip sales.

I'm a Celtic fan and I honestly think its about the best looking Rangers strip I've seen. Stylish and understated is how my wife describes it.

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Painful being bitter.....over the 5 stars ?
You should be embarrassed. Stars, leading way back to early schoodays, are earned through merit. Not through cheating.
We may only have 1 star on our jersey but its a large gold one earned by winning the BIG ONE which you tried to emulate and resulted in the mess you are in today. We can wear ours with pride.......Hail Hail to the Lisbon Lions..

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No stars above our crest
thats because Rangers are dead
as a newco we will shine
and get our stars back in time.

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Should have incorporated a velcro Club badge so it can be swapped-over to a Govan Utd one quickly.

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Great strip will be a massive seller clever marketing harking back to the good old days

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Yes the "good" old days of bigotry eh!!

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Do you reckon I should stock-up on them in case they become as collectible as Third Lanark ones?

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NEW STRIP IS CRAIG WHYTE LADS. Im just being honest. Who designed it, duff and duffer on theyre lunch break. and why hide the 5 stars in dark blue stitching on the shoulder. im only saying what u are all thinking. of course ill buy 1 to support the club but a bit dissapointed. Larger old style badge is nice though.

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To op jjb have already paid for strips

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take the time to actually watch the promo vid on the rangers site,yous will see that the design was to emulate the top from the cup winners cup,in honour of thier succsess,hence the reason the stars are on the sleeve

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That new celik wan looks more like sportin lisbon strip , theyl no be shoutin c,mon the hoops noo , it,ll be c,mon the stripes

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Can't believe ppl think this is good, give my three year old a crayon and ask him to do a rangers strip, it's boring, plain, pathetic in fact.

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Too similar to the Peterhead strip, might cause confusion next season.

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26 Apr 2012 11:25:37
liking the new retro strip for next season

Believable17 Unbelievable14

I'm a Celtic Fan and even I must admit it's a pretty cool strip. Damn you Rangers!

Our new strip will be our 125th anniversary strip and rumour was that it would be slightly retro, so it'll be interesting to see what that looks like.

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Do not think its retro, think its recycling to save money lol

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Aye it will go down a storm in the 3rd Division eh? pmsl

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To the above poster...Division 3, Division whatever... i will be wearing my new top with the pride i have worn my last 32, let them relegate us, fine us, deduct points from us, ban us from buying new players, take titles of us, whatever else they can think of to throw at us...what they can't do is stop me being a Ranger. WATP

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26 Apr 2012 10:32:40
Ed - Any more info on the bidders? {Ed001's Note - nothing new, just waiting on D&P to take the next step.}

Believable7 Unbelievable3

At least all this SFA furore has allowed the bidders time to negotiate a final deal with Ticketus.

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Who are the bidders again!

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26 Apr 2012 09:06:12
Rangers to resign from SPL with immediate affect should have did this last month but as per usual dilly and dally hummed and hawed but eventually come to their senses

Believable28 Unbelievable35

What utter crap.....even as a celtic supporter and a frequent commentor to the Hector site, even I am not having this one....why the hell would they resign....going and have your medicines.

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You have to give two years notice don't you?

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Talking rubbish timmy!

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Is that you Neil in timmy dream land again...now put your dummy back in and back to sleep

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In the SPL the TV rights are governed by the League, what is the situation within the SFL can a club sell the rights to its games, if this is the case then if Rangers down move down to the Bottom of the SFL they could set up TV rights globally for there games.

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Sfl agreed to talk Rangers in? Plus notice period , plus global tv to watch Rangers v east fife, Albion Rivers, East Stirling when the teams made up of kids grow up

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Once either of the Old Firm are gone then the TV rights issue will become a free for all. Anyone could bid. Sky wouldn't be interested. The price would plummet.

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Can,t wait rangers 2012 v stranraer on pay per view what a laugh

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SFL already talking up Dundee potentially being promoted which create space in SFL.

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Same poster who says Ally is resigning utter rubbish

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For a new club to be entered into the SFL they require to have had 3 years of audited accounts. This means Rangers would need to take over another team to allow this to happen.

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A rangers fan in oz would happily subscribed to watch the bears against anyone.

The subscription fee would need to be priced right

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2 years notice period. Only way you are getting out the SPL is liquidation or relegation.

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26 Apr 2012 08:46:49
Hi Ed. Not a rumour but a rant from a Rangers supporter of nearly 50 years standing. Nobody can dispute that there have been wrongdoings at the club but nobody has been charged (yet) with a crime! Businesses do get into trouble and fail and some recover. Rangers have brought so much to Scottish football over the last 100 years or more and it seems to me that many people wish to stick the boot in when they are down. Why such bitterness? They went into administration for goodness sake - they didn't cause harm to anyone else. I think the way that the SPL & FA are treating Rangers is disgraceful. Why keep adding punishment to the list? They lost the SPL title this year because of the 10 point deduction. Why impose even more? Rangers, the club and their fans should never forget the people who have put the knife in and I think they should seriously consider applying to join the Football League and leave them all to it. WATP. {Ed022's Note - I understand what you're saying mate, but it's a difficult one. I'd say the sfa needed to do something to act as a deterrent, and they went as lightly as they could. The formalities of Administration are a points deduction, so it was necessity.}

Believable13 Unbelievable27

Rangers has 276 financial victims.
And now SFA panel and director victims

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This is rubbish......

Two fundamental things that Rangers did that were wrong.

1. Failed to pay HMRC by using a 'hooky' method of avoiding paying TAX/NINO by using an EBT.

2. Failed to pay up for transfers and/or clubs gate receipts.

Last time I checked NONE of the other clubs in Scotland had ever gone down this route.

So it might appear harsh, but, if we let Rangers off with it, then all clubs can do whatever they want.

If Rangers do not want to abide by the rules set down by the SFA (of which they are a member), then they can go an sling their hook elsewhere. {Ed022's Note - Good post.}

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Totally agree with you mate, except one point, we have caused harm to other clubs.

However much I loathe to admit it, we owe/owed money to Hearts, Dundee Utd, Durfermline, St Eteinne (sp), Rapid Vienna and others, and that is only for transfers and gates!

What about the damage done in Manchester, and before that, seats at Pittodrie, and I think Fir park too?!

It's a small minority that brings shame on the rest of us fans, but it's what everyone remembers us for.

We are the tainted, not the people. :-(

P.s I'd rather start at the bottom of England than SFL3 too, but that's just my personal opinion!

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The club continues to be punished as it has continued to break rules , administration because you ran out of money , automatically losing 10 pts.
The sfa charges found Rangers guilty of 5 charges so punished them accordingly, the punishment will continue as more wrong doing is uncovered. Question if you commit numerous crimes do you think its right to only be punished once

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Our Government is broke and needs tax payments. Institutions like Rangers not paying their taxes stops better medication getting patients and care for the elderly and children in need.

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Even if rangers were not docked 10 points celtic would have still won the SPL title.

Feck97

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Wow where do I start?

We lost the league because our manager and our players threw away a 15 point lead before we went into administration. We are currently 18 points behind not 10.

As for not causing harm to anyone else, Dunfermaline had to short pay their players one month because we hadn't sent them ticket money that was theirs, Hearts players are regularly paid late and we haven't come close to paying for Lee Wallace. No-one even seem to want to pay Dundee Utd. Add to that people such as the Paper boys and the face painters (Yes I am mentioning them again) we have hurt lots of people inside and outside of football.

As far as punishing Rangers even more, I think generally speaking most of the punishments have been at the lower end of what could have been handed down.

Finally the situation is not helped when our own manager starts a witch hunt for the three panel members who took the decision, an outburst that has led to them being offered police protection. This at a time when the architects of our desctruction Whyte & D Murray go about their daily routines.

Finally I presume by joining the football league you mean in England. What makes you think they'll want us? They already have enough teams who can't pay their bills why would they want one more? Or do you think this would be a way round the transfer embargo, I suspect that would follow us there!

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Don't have a ,problem with sanctions or fines or even transfer embargo
but - surely the best solution is to allow RFC to come out of this position and put things right!!
NOT as the bloodthirsty posters on here want - complete extinction - which is now a real possibility!!
wheres my prozac?

bill72

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As naive and arrogant as you can get.

The line that really stands out is 'they didn't cause harm to anyone else'. Did you see the list of creditors? What about Dunfermiline who couldn't pay wages when Rangers defaulted or Hearts who had their best player taken with little chance of being paid for him? Then there is the moral question of the debts to HMRC, this is essentially money in the public purse you know the one that pays for hospitals, schools, the forces, welfare etc.

Let's be clear this was not due to a business downturn or economic conditiond it was achieved through decades of reckless spending, inflating the transfer market, tax avoidance and financial doping - i.e. of your own making. The perfect example is when Celtic were interested in Jelavic and decided that they couldn't afford him at the price quoted, Rangers however who clearly really couldn't afford him and went ahead despite knowing the consequences. The result is that they got the benefit of a class player, sold him for a profit without even paying the agreed transfer fee to his previous club, still not hurting anyone?

I think that Rangers would get far more sympathy if they dropped the 'it wisnae oor fault' and 'we'll kill Scottish fitba' attitude and tried to face up to the truth and show some contrition. Cheeky chappy Ally's latest outburst against the SFA was tantamount to incitement and summed up the 'We're Rangers we're above the law' attitude currently being displayed by so many.

I do want Rangers to survive but there has to be consequences, punishment and a few years of humility to atone for past crimes. If they are found guilty of the dual contracts then this punishment will look like a slap on the wrist.

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We didn't cause anyone any harm?? Think about what you say before you right it down

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Are you for real????
What's the point gap at the moment?
Rangers lost the league as they were quite simply not good enough.

Open your eyes and admit what is happening to your club has been purely self inflicted.

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The way I see it, Rangers were deducted 10 points for going into administration by the SPL, and a transfer embargo imposed by the SFA for the financial consequences of being in administration. Although nothing criminal may have occurred under CW, there is no doubt his unprofessional governance threatened the financial securityof other clubs, and damaged the reputation of the SPL. It was bad enough he did not pay any HMRC contributions but worse still, he didn't use any of this capital to pay other SPL members their dues.
Now we await the penalties Rangers must face from the SFA and possibly UEFA for the EBT scam, it is going to get worse before it gets better I am afraid.


Craig Whyte is an expert at orchestrating administrations but he was not an expert on SFA rules concerning improper governance, it was a big mistake.

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Have to laugh at the people who post on hear pretending to be Rangers fans, you can see right through them!

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Both Ally and CW fail to appreciate that Rangers is not some autonomous business, they are part of a trading association whose duty it is to protect its members and its financial reputation.

Orchestraing an administration at the expense of both may not be crimina, but its clearly a serious breach of association rules.
Craig Whyte is not used to being part of a trading block, he works on his own and his actions demonstrate this philosophy.

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I'm a member of three professional institutes. If I stuff up in my professional life all three will punish me independently for the one mistake.

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They didn't cause harm to anyone else? That's absurd. Try explaining that to all the football clubs and small business Rangers owe money to.

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Rangers can not play football against themselves, they need opponents as partners, and they can not survive as a stand alone entity.
Rangers can not treat their partners as if they do not exist or matter, and then expect their partners to turn the other cheek.

Take the medecine and move on, if the price Rangers must pay for 10 years of selfishness is losing their history, then so be it.

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Rangers would have lost the league even though they got 10 points docked so dont blame the SFA. I find it interesting how the press have not looked at David Murray's role he is the real reason Rangers are in a state. Its a worry that our media have somehow forgotten about this. Succulent Lamb!

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I don't accept they are being punished twice for the same mistake, they are being punished for going into administration with its financial consequences for its trading partners, and they are being punished for the way in which administration was orchestrated.
There was no mistake in the latter, it was intentional.

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I don't think you can blame Rangers for not paying the other teams when they have been placed in administration.

Perhaps the rules should be changed in Scotland. The problem about paying other teams is that there are no rules in place to put them at the front of the queue. this is a legal process and they can't prioritise the other teams by law.

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CW himself recently admitted he should have called in the administrators in October, this is a serious admission because in effect he allowed Rangers to continue trading for 4 months when he knew they were insolvent.

In reality Rangers were intentionally running up 4 months of debt to credtors they knew they could not pay.

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Rangers fans must accept their club is liable for the actions of its owner, they are not two different entities.
Ally's comments were naive and almost childlike, of course Rangers is responsible for the wrong doing and it is Rangers who must pay the price.

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You have been cheating for a decade or maybe 2 and maybe more with the old funny handshakes! You have cheated players and clubs of finance and perhaps glory in their careers so how is that not harmed anyone? You have cheated multiple businesses of cash, how is that not harming anyone? You want a CVA, how will that not harm anyone? Pay your debts that won't harm anyone!

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Rangers (in administration), Ally McCoist and the fans of this club are a disgrace. The sooner they shut the place down, the better for all. I cant wait for them to be liquidated, I really cant.

What McCoist did was endanger the lives of the panel by saying he wants them named. I hope you are really suffering Ally.

Hail Hail
TonyBhoy

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10 points did not cost you the league. Have them back and you still won't win the league. Al

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This charge of Ł160,000 and 12 month ban is simply for Craig Whyte not paying VAT and NI.

This we are guilty of. I think people are thinking this is to do with the BTC which it is not

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Its just a shame that we always attract the knuckledragger who probally never goes to the games im sick of these so called rangers fans your not welcolme hope they are jailed this carry on is a disgrace im sure 99.9 percent of gers fans are shocked and would would be appalled by these faceless yobs we have to take it on the chin rules are rules

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Basically bad governance means trading while insolvent, CW himself admits he should have called in the administrators in October. The SFA were also concerned with the financial repurcussions on its other members and the financial integrity of the association itself.
Rangers fans includng Ally want to seperate CW's actions from RFC, but for all intensive purposes they share joint liability.

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"I don't think you can blame Rangers for not paying the other teams when they have been placed in administration.

Perhaps the rules should be changed in Scotland. The problem about paying other teams is that there are no rules in place to put them at the front of the queue. this is a legal process and they can't prioritise the other teams by law."

Rangers knew perfectly well what their financial status was when they bought Jelavic, Wallace and Celik. They knew that these teams were very unlikely to get paid when they committed to buy these players.

There should be better safeguards for other football teams owed money during an insolvency event. Hearts sold Wallace for 1.5 million, a figure they could easily have got from an English team but now if Rangers pay 10p in the pound they will have effectively lost one of their best players for Ł780,000.

Mac

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WHY? Just have a look at the history,but that really isnt the point,rules have been broken,no matter what has happened there has to be punishment and thats what going on

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26 Apr 2012 04:15:06
I back ally 110% correct on his comments. Sfa have no cause to punish ally as he is correct nd sfa r to faced they say they would help us to survive well what they have done is they might have put the final nail in our coffin nd 1 of the panel is 100% a Celtic fan. If it turns out true they can say a BIG goodbye to £80m+ tv deal nd to the biggest nd best club ever nd no it aint celcrap its RANGERS FC {Ed022's Note - I wouldn't put the blame on a single Celtic fan.}

Believable20 Unbelievable37

Unbelievable. This is for the guy who posted this top comment. You are obviously not a real Rangers fan. How could you back the worst performing manager in the clubs history and stand by him as he put 3 lives at risk. You are one of the knuckle draggers who give this famous football club a bad name. He deserves to leave the position of manager as soon as possible and you should turn your colours in after your remark.

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You are the reason your club isnt receiving any support
This WATP nonsense only makes you look like a bunch of arrogant, knuckle dragging needs!
Wake up your club has been breaking rules and financially doping itself for years.
You have cheated all clubs in Scotland out of money and European football.
Accept the Punishment with good grace, apologise for the crimes and hope you can survive!
Show some remorse and you might get some support

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I heard on the news today that some threats have been made to the people revealed as voting to impose fine/ban on RFC. This is truly shameful, I am no longer a rangers fan. C'mon the Thisle. {Ed022's Note - This is correct.}

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So what's the difference between what ally said and lennons on pitch behaviour. If one is inflammatory so indeed is the other. Did ally give out said names? Need to look a bit deeper than the rangers manager. Unreal. {Ed022's Note - Ally knew the names but still decided to publically ask for them and put their well being at risk. It's a stupid, stupid thing to do, and he should publically retract those comments before much more harm is caused.}

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I think the OP should have spent more time in school and less on the bucky!

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Well said ed022 {Ed022's Note - Thanks.}

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Here we have a manager who by his ill-thought statements at worst elicits, or even encourages, the worst knuckle-dragging elements of his team’s supporters to grab their battleaxes and march on the headquarters of the SFA, pitchforks and burning torches (maybe ropes and whit e robes with pointy hats?) at the ready. He accuses the SFA panel of possibly putting the final nail in Rangers’ coffin, but a coffin needs many nails to secure its lid, and the other nails include Murray’s mismanagement, the financial sleight of hand of the EBTs, the sale to Craig Whyte, his financial wizardry, the threats and “bombs” directed at Neil Lennon, etc, etc. It may well be that Mr McCoist himself has put the final, final nail in the coffin, in that Scottish football might now say “OK, enough is enough, we’ve had it”, and decide that the best thing for Scottish football’s reputation, if not its financial well-being, is to euthanise RFC. Remember it was only a few years ago that Rangers (and the other guys) decided that they didn’t need the SPL, heading down south was their prime focus. Now, all we hear is “Scottish football needs the Old Firm”.
And, now that Rangers are in the brown stuff, their fans are taking umbrage that people are apparently enjoying the schadenfreude associated with their potential extinction, it’s perhaps appropriate to bring up Super Ally’s comments, that he “couldn’t say he wasn’t enjoying it”
Rangers have skewed the financial landscape of Scottish football to their advantage by their illegal dealings, perhaps cheating Celtic out of Championships, perhaps cheating clubs like Hearts, Motherwell, Aberdeen, etc, in years gone by, of 2nd places and depriving them of European participation and the resultant financial benefits, and should consider themselves luck that the penalties applied by the SFA this week are all they were handed down, in the current circumstances, it amounts to little more than a slap on the wrist, as even the transfer embargo means nothing, they can’t even afford to pay for some of the players they’ve recently sold, never mind still have.
It ain’t all good for the other end of Glasgow where we have a manager, running about in a cheap trackie, foaming at the mouth and ranting at folk like a wee ned oot o his face on Buckie. Can any Celtic supporter mentally put Jock Stein’s head on that of Mr Lennon ranting at a ref and see it making a coherent picture? But that’s less dangerous, and more easily dealt with. I have a mate, a dyed-in-the-wool ‘Tic fan, since 1963, and his only word for NL is “ned”. He won’t waste any more of his (significant) brain power (2 degrees and a directorship of a major company) trying to come up with anything more. Perhaps the removal of RFC from the scene will help to eliminate that crazy, uncontrolled intensity from the equation, but still leave the necessary, and worthwhile, passion.

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There is absolutely no doubt that McCoist must resign for incitement!

He is lacking in judgement.

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Why should ally resign?
Every right to make the point that we should know who the 3 are 110%.
Not fit to judge a pie eating contest never mind make judgement on Rangers.
Ally is the reason Rangers are still alive.
And to the septic fans, stick to your own page and get a life, do the housework or something

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Nothing bitter & twisted here then

move along

bill72

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To the OP -
Did you know one of the members of the 3 man panel was a Rangers season ticket holder?
Ally's comments were ill advised at best, inflammatory at worst.
He would be fully aware of what consequences his outburst would be.
The only people putting any nails in a coffin are the mindless idiots who reacted in a very predictable way.
Who in their right mind would want ANYTHING to do with you?
Newcastle, Manchester, Europe, the list is endless AND shameful.

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Ally cracked under the continuos strain but I genuinely don't believe his rant was intended to intimidate, however it was inappropriate and he may have to fall on his sword.
My initial reaction was the embargo was excessive, however on reflection the SFA must dissuade cowboys like CW ruining the financial reputaton and security of Scottish football. It does not matter if he did anything criminal, he orchestrated an administration at the expense of his fellow trading partners.

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"Well said ed022" + 1.

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Any football club can not trade on its own, it needs partners and rules to govern these partners. Rangers broke rules that damaged its partners and behaved selfishly at the expense of its partners. Rangers is part of an association of trading partners, CW or any other owner can not intentionally orchestrate an administration that affects their partners and get away with it.

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Im a dundee utd fan. your manager is a disgrace i hope he can sleep at night i hope the sfa though the book at him for his comments

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Just when I thought things could not get any lower for my beloved club - then this.

I have never felt ashamed being a Rangers supporter until the last couple of days.

Ally should not have been put in front of the camera when his emotions were so raw.

I have no doubt this inflamed the situation which now sees the police warning individuals for their safety. For all the years we have accused 'them' of making threats we have never before had this sort of Police response (apart from the Neil Lennon case).

This is a dark dark day for our club.

Big G.

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A season ticket holder?
One is running a pub team, one is a "legal expert" and one has a history of failed businesses.
I can see how they are fit to make a decision like this.
Wait till I crack a rib laughing!
This is the Sfa's fault, they should have said who the 3 were.
They should have known we weren't going to take this from amateurs who think they can judge rangers.
Failed business man, remind you of anyone???

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It is not the SFAs fault that Rangers orchestrated an administration at the expense of its fellow members.
Rangers are part of the SFA, the 3 judges were apponted by the members representatives.

Rangers can not play football against themselves, they need partners, I suggest shafting your partners is not a good idea when you need them to survive.

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Mr McCoist talks about transparency.
Last year Rangers FC was one of 93 constituent members of the SFA who voted 93 votes to zero for the implementation of the procedure the SFA operated in the review being discussed here.
That procedure (signed up to by Rangers FC and all SFA members) was operated correctly.
That procedure sought to protect the anonymity of those making decisions.
Mr McCoist knew (or as Manager of Rangers FC, should have known).
Mr McCoist knew (or should have known, via his iwn FC) who the individuals are.
Mr McCoist appeared on a pre-recorded, edited programme on his own FC's TV station and it was presumably seen by governing members of his FC, or sanctioned by them either explicitly or implicitly before publication.
Mr McCoist must be aware of the strength of feeling around in the Rangers FC circles; if he is not then he is living in splendid isolation.
It follows therefore that he and/or his advisers were at best misguided in allowing these comments to be aired publicly.
If we examine these facts, does it not appear that Mr McCoist has some serious personal questions to ask of himself, as well as professional questions.

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If there are Rangers fans out there who genuinely believe their club is more important than the association they are a member of, then think again.

Try playing football on your own, its not very profitable nor interesting to watch.

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Anyone who thinks the manager of rangers should or would have not stuck up for his club is deluded. It's his duty to protect the interests of the.club. someone has to. It may have been advisable to run those comments by someone first but to who? His chairman? His director of football? The sfa? Exactly. It was an emotional interview which may have caused harm. But who released the names? {Ed022's Note - Yes but the problem is he already knew the names, surely he would have realised it'd cause nothing but harm to say his comments public?}

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McCoist now backing away from the implications of his previous rant demonstrates why he shouldn't rant like that in the first place. Rules are there for a reason.

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So what he said was as a rangers fan I want to know who was in a position to make this decision. Maybe he was talking about rangers fans. Not nut jobs . I'm a rangers fan and id like to know who made the decision. Don't mean I'm hell bent on causing these people trouble. Problem is
Nobody thinks of the ordinary honest fan. Were all just bigots and terrorists. Can't say anything in case the weirdos cause trouble. Problem with this country . The real fans of rangers fc get kept in the dark.

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Heat of the moment excuse is a non-starter, sorry.
It was a pre-recorded, edited program Released on their own TV channel.
Ally was fully aware of the names, and the only reason for the comments was to inflame the Rangers support. Well he got what he wanted!
Everyone involved in it should be ashamed and charged by the Police and also the SFA for yet again bringing the game into disrepute.
For all those saying you deserved to know the names - 93-0 that was the vote by all the SFA members (including Rangers) who passed the new rules guaranteeing anonymity for the panel members.
If the last 24hrs can't convince you why it is needed there really isn't any hope for you.

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There was nothing wrong in Ally echoing the dire implications of the embargo, however he did more than that, and that was wrong.

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I have listened to the " who are these people " rant, it doesn't matter which way one views it, its a display of emotional arrogance.
Ally is questioning the right of appointed representatives of the association they are a member of, to dish out penalties.

Rangers voted for this right.

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Neil lennon questions the right of appointed representatives of the association they are a member of (referees), he even accuses them of personal bias and anti-celtic bias! away back to your own deluded page. Yes McCoist made a mistake. but if you are demanding he quit/be sacked why havent you demanded the sacking of your manager for questioning the SFA decisions? double standards me thinks...

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Unfortunately ally was not just questioning the SFA decisions,
In my opinion he was only inciting threats to the people revealed as voting to impose sanctions on RFC.
He knew what the knuckle dragging bigoted fans would do.
(not all Rangers fans are knuckle dragging bigots)

Feck97

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RFC knew who sat on the panel as they were represented there by one of their own. If The Fat Le Guen had really wanted to know who the three were he onl;y needed to ask one of his own staff. This outing call was a calculated call and was very careless if not dangerous.

Lets hope none of these volunteers come to any harm a a result of AM's recklessness.

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25 Apr 2012 19:43:40
ED022 not seen you on this site before
so welcome....
Just reading some of your answers
about SFA sanctions.... and you said
"they were unfair" in what way?
The actual sanctions were very mild
considering they could have kicked
club out of Scottish cup or even out
of SPL.. Rangers got a slap on the wrist
Believe me there is far more to come
out and once the Big Tax verdict is
known there will be no place for
Rangers Fc to hide, if you think the
club is embarrassed now, wait until
all the details become public.
Sadly, the true Rangers fans have
been let down by some very shady
directors and owners (not just Whyte)
Sir David Murray knew exactly what
he was doing with EBT's to try and
"buy" the European Cup.. Timalloy {Ed022's Note - Thanks mate. I've actually done some research into the sfa sanctions etc and I realise my previous answer was wrong. In fact, Rangers should feel incredibly lucky to even still be in the spl. But hey, that's just fact.}

Believable31 Unbelievable20

Nice to see a man who can change his opinion after some research. Too many of us have tunnel vision were football is concerned. Hat off to you Ed22 {Ed022's Note - It's not easy to publically admit you're wrong, but it had to be done. In retrospect, Ally should now do the same.}

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I would personally happier if we did leave the spl.

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Ed022 - get a grip. Lucky to even still be in the SPL? Rangers haven't been found guilty of anything with the tax case. They've been found guilty of being run by a man not fit for purpose - by the same SFA which was happy to wine and dine with Whyte and assure him things were okay. If they had done their job (along with a few others at Ibrox it has to be said) then Rangers wouldn't be in this position now (which has NOTHING to do with the big tax case and everything about Whyte selling us out). {Ed022's Note - Get a grip? You're the individual clearly deluded enough to even suggest Rangers are 'hard done by'. I actually got off my arse and researched into it, and it's pretty damn clear Murray ran this club into the ground. Regardless of the whole 'Whyte' saga, which the media seem to just adore, the club should have never been sold in the first place. I agree the sfa should have done more to help the club in earlier days, but they're trying to do what's best at the moment and be lenient. They could have done much, much worse, so try to think for yourself rather than following ludicrous comments from your manager.}

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Timalloy and celtic ed you do realise it was not just Rangers that benifited from the SBTs Celtic qualified for a competition that they had no legel right to be in hopefully you will stand up and take your punishment for years and years of living off Rangers Achievments robbing clubs of gate reciepts prize money and tv rights 2s up when UEFA COME LOOKING FOR THE 10`s of millions German clubs are ready to pounce and quit rightly so As for a fair hearing you are talking absolute nonsense we are being punished for SFA INCOMPETENCE AND NEGLECT were the actual guilty party are being paid a fine for not doing there job

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Ed022 is correct -
Some sanctions that were in the panels remit to apply -
a) Thrown out of the Scottish Cup.
b) Thrown out of league.

Personally the only thing I find bizarre is the fines! Whats the point?
CW wont pay his.
RFC given 12 months to pay, does a newco in SF3 avoid this?
I would guess as in the transfer embargo it will be linked to the SPL share in the event of a parachute back into the SPL.
People should be very aware, the sanctions were NOT because you are in admin (10 points deduction for that), they were for shafting other clubs and the taxman.
Whats going to happen when the BTC comes homes to roost, and their are SPL penalties on top of those just imposed?

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Rangers were penalised for the way in which they entered administration, it was an intentional and orchestrated act.
CW never paid one single contribution to HMRC and paid few other creditors during his brief and selfish governance. The consequences of this to other SPL clubs could have been liquidation, and the financial collapse of the SPL.

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Hi Ed, Can you tell me if Rangers could take players on who are not with a club at the end of the season. i.e. no transfer as such invoved.Reason i ask is there is usually a few half decent players around who have no club. Thanks {Ed001's Note - no, they are not able to register new players over the age of 18.}

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Newco in SFL3 will probably avoid this, yes. But the newco will not have the so-called history either, which I personally think is made too much of. The team playing in blue at Ibrox will be Rangers to all intents and purposes whatever the bureaucrats say.

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26 Apr 2012 00:12:12
Ally McCoist is to leave club tomorrow with rest of senior coaching staff. Told that Craid Mulhollabd will be caretaker manager. Heard up to half the first team will be transfer listed. McCoist has been linked with a coaching job at Sunderland. Craziest think I have heard is he's Been linked with a coaching and scouting roll with new USA team New York Cosmos.

Believable34 Unbelievable48

Lots of rumours after the pubs close, and its only a Wednesday.

Shame on you.

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Wouldnt surprise me if he did we dont do walking away could have suited his agenda at the time so it will be hard for him to change his mind hes in a no win situation at the moment i think the manager is under great pressure at the moment

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Rangers dont do walking away!

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Why would Martin O'Neil want McCoist?

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His position now is untenable.
SFA should remove his managers license.

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He was a good rangers player but in management he has the worst record going sorry to say

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Rumour it's McCoist going Durrant taking over.

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Alex Thomson on twitter commenting on McCoist and wondering what SFA and Strathclyde Police will do about it?

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AFTER HIS DISGUSTING RANT AT sfa PANEL AND INSTIGATING THE THREATS MADE TO THEM, HE SHOULD BE THROWN OUT OF FOOTBALL FOREVER! Disgusting, vile club {Ed022's Note - Ally's comments were indeed stupid beyond belief, but I'm sure there was no intention on his behalf to cause potential attacks etc, but I understand what you're saying.}

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Ian Durrant taking over, why would we want that? Perhaps so he can continue his 100% record (played 1 - Dunfermline in the Scottish cup - lost 1)

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Seems to be a "question of sport?"

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No one could accuse ally on not realising the incendiary nature of any comments he makes in his position...........

But Shirley he could see how some of his comments could be picked up by a rabble ?????

This is rangers and Celtic we talking about, years of bile and fights and deaths......

And sadly some of the greatest football matches on the planet, to boot

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Pub talk is mostly fans just guessing and regularly talking rubbish. I general just listen to them and wait. I personaly can not see McCoist leaving. Really from what I have heard I think Rangers will live on, but the punchment I was expecting it to be harder, Much harder.

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More rubbish posts...McCoist is staying and will be joined by others at Ibrox in the Boardroom sooner than you think......

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26 Apr 2012 00:06:49
McCoist to walk tomorrow is the rumour tonight.. I wouldnt have thought it was true but it is everywhere tonight.

Believable25 Unbelievable36

Every SPL club knew the procedural changes for the disciplinary panel and approved them. Alyy McCoist knew the rules and that anonymity was required for safety and security reasons. Ally knew this. He premeditated his speech to deliberately threaten the anonymity rules which he knew were designed for safety reasons. Hence it was a deliberate act to remove the safety of the panel. Make no mistake about it.

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I'm 54 and Ally is potentially facing the greatest disciplinary case against a Scottish football manager I can ever remember.

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He's just put the 3 people in the SFA panel's safety in jeopardy! There was a Rangers rep at the meeting, why did he need to call for them to be named when he could ask his own rep? This is getting lower and lower, did you expect a quick funny handshake and all would be forgotten?

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Did he realy, did he ask for them to be threatend? did he ask for such a harsh punishment, did ally give out the punishment NO, would the pepole who have threatend them have found out how the panel was evenyually YES, The SPL was always releasing the names, Ally only said what every fan was thinking and he had every right to ask, the same right as any manager, he never slagged the SPL or SFA, he ASKED and gave his opinion of the descision which is allowed. and dont try and compare this to lennon, because it is completly diffrent. {Ed001's Note - actually the clubs had all agreed that panel members' names would not be released, so the SPL were not going to release the names.}

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Rangers fan here hope these threats are not true we must abide by the rules hope these morons are brought before the law its idiots like this that give our fans a bad name your not welcolme at ibrox throw the book at them and the full force of the law

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The Telegraph released the names. {Ed022's Note - Then they'll face a serious law-suit and be sued for everything they have.}

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Its times like these we need freinds and support from other clubs these stupid threats have set us back even more if your so called rangers fans we dont need your type clear off for good we are sick to the teeth of these so called fans no wonder other fans hate us

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Everybody knew the rules , Ally is lashing out at the wrong ppl its his good buddy Murray that he wants to get a grip of , Murray will be remembered for 9 in a row and also helping kill the club

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I don't think Ally purposefully meant to incite any threats towards the SFA panel. This is a man who is Rangers through and through and was, whether rightly or not, upset and shocked at the SFA decision. I am sure he will look back with hindsight and feel ashamed.

Should he walk? No.

Should he be pushed? No.

Or at least not for this incident... his management record is another matter.

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Ed, who are these guys , fellow fans who think Ally will walk. Ally would never turn his back on Rangers, not for anything. Load of c**p. Gers will shed jobs undoubtably, but come on, Ally walk, NEVER.

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I would like to think that he did not intend to incite the knuckle heads within the Ibrox support but given threats have been made to people enforcing the rules agreed by Rangers FC he has done exactly that - he should resign forthwith.

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So lets get this straight, Ally is Rangers through and through and he was upset ,so that make it all ok? (tell me then why do you hate Lenny so much? As you say a man who loves his club and acts in the heat of the moment ,sometimes in an ill judged way)Dont make me laugh Ally knew what he was doing ,your own fans were going on about how calm and composed he was when he made the call for the panel to be named, dont forget Ally and Rangers knew who they where it was just an appeal to the knukle draggers. He is the worst manager you have had (in my memory) but he keeps blaming everyone else for his and Rangers failings. Ally if he has a shred of dignity should walk

Dannybhoy

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Well said Dannybhoy!

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